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Developer Skills Report

research.hackerrank.com

181–190 of 198 posts

Re: Developer Skills Report

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they're offering such wages and getting candidates to work for such wages, then that's the (local) market wage, by definition. Pay of developers elsewhere and cost of life are not relevant, "market wages" is the salary level (in that particular market) where the job offers and willing candidates meet. All your arguments state "the market wage here is low compared to other markets", not companies not offering marke…

> If they're offering such wages and getting candidates to work for such wages, then that's the (local) market wage, by definition Let me phrase it this way - it's very difficult to find software dev/eng older than 33-35 and the only career path for them is middle management (i.e. distributing tight budget over undemanding workforce). The employers notoriously complain for not being able to find "specialists".

That's only true if you're looking to work for one of the cool, hip, startups. There are plenty of older devs working in boring corporate jobs that are not interested in changing the world. I'm one of them.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Again, so what? My responsible is to myself, my spouse, and my kids. I'm going to move to wherever I can get the better quality of life for us is. If I have dependent relatives like parents, they would have to move where I move. EDIT: Thanks for the possible clarification. I'm thinking very US centric. I forgot that many other cultures seem to place a higher value on being close to and living with extended family tha…

> I'm going to move to wherever I can get the better quality of life for us is Not just non-US families. I worked with a guy years ago who complained about pay. He was paid ok but not great. I told him about some other opps which would double his pay, and not in high COL areas either - roughly one midwest town to another. He wouldn't consider it, because they were too close to family in that area - his family, his wi…

Increase salary over a certain point has decreasing marginal utility. Where that decreasing marginal utility is, is based on the person.

In the last 6 years. I've had two major bumps by changing jobs - both 20K. The first 20K made life a lot easier on our family. Allowed us to buy a house the size we wanted in the neighborhood we wanted. The 2nd 20K helped us be able to save, pay down debt aggressively, help our older son who is just starting out on his own. The path to making another 20K bump would lead to either contracting (would probably mean giving up my flexible schedule as the dev lead), consulting (a lot of traveling), or middle management (no interest in giving up actual hands on coding). The first two options aren't something I want to do until my son graduates. I never want to do the third options.

If I was forced to make the same choices to get the first 20K bump, I would have, the second bump, maybe. But I'm not willing to do that now.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#183

> Irrespective of your job, it will become important for everyone to learn how to code It strikes me that the person who wrote that is used to associating with technical people, and might spend a little more time in the real world. I work in a company of 100 ish people, 15 are delivery drivers. 40 odd are sales assistants that customers value for their detailed product knowledge. 4 are involved in cleaning of differe…

I was the author. I could have reworded. I still think computational thinking is an important skill irrespective of your job role & is actually a pretty powerful tool that helps you solve problems and make decisions. Coding is one of the fastest ways to get there.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#184
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vivek (founder/ceo of hackerrank) here. Appreciate your comments. When we started HackerRank, it was oriented towards problem solving / algorithmic challenges which assess a certain level of computational thinking skill -- can you break large problems into sub-problems and solve? I still believe this is a good measure but somehow algorithm challenges have been associated with asking complex red-black trees / graph th…

Humble suggestion: add more front end-specific challenges. I do a lot of front end work. I cannot begin to tell you how irritating (infuriating?) it is to have a company express interest, send over a HackerRank test, and then you find out that they picked a bunch of algo questions that have nothing to do with building a UI. This happens more often than you'd think.

Agree. agree. we really need to work on that.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think half the reason companies can't find talent is: 1. They wouldn't know it if it hit them in the face. 2. They actively repel talent by their interviewing practices. 3. They refuse to learn form this mistake. Since it couldn't possibly be them (they are infallible of course), it must be the talent.

This is 100% true. Earlier in my career I might have jumped through these types of hoops because I needed a job. Today, if a potential employer were to tell me I needed to go write X test program for free or do some bullshit test on Hacker Rank I would just say, "No thanks, I've got better things to do." Then I would move on to the next employer. At this stage in my career when I still get this type of bullshit from…

About the same experience with my current job.

It was a contract to perm position. I asked my now manager, why was this a contract to perm position? Was it because they wanted to see if the person was a good fit or were they under a budget constraint that might stop me from coming on permanently? He said the former.

I had to create the department from scratch with basically nothing but "database developers" who were just learning C# and no infrastructure. I laid out a 6 month plan. Six months in, i was able to negotiate a higher pay than I could have originally since it was my first official lead role and make extra money by being able to bill hourly. It was a major win.

When I was single without the skill set, network, or health benefits from my spouse, I would have never left a full time position for a contract to perm.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If they're offering such wages and getting candidates to work for such wages, then that's the (local) market wage, by definition Let me phrase it this way - it's very difficult to find software dev/eng older than 33-35 and the only career path for them is middle management (i.e. distributing tight budget over undemanding workforce). The employers notoriously complain for not being able to find "specialists".

That's only true if you're looking to work for one of the cool, hip, startups. There are plenty of older devs working in boring corporate jobs that are not interested in changing the world. I'm one of them.

That’s corporate jobs I’m talking about. We refactor and support that awful ASP.NET web app written hecticly 10 years ago by some hipsters, we develop products for markets which are not so profitable or prestigious. There are almost no cool hip startups and those existng are not worth attention because they pay peanuts and usually are just proxy for cheap labour. I think we are talking about completely different job markets.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have never understood the point of HackerRank. I even got into it with fairly high-up executives at my last job for refusing to fall in-line and use it as a tool. As far as I'm concerned all it does is exacerbate the already terrible hiring practices and hiring biases that plague the software industry. I'm now CTO of a company operating a space that's as challenging as it is esoteric. We make hardware for adding by…

I really like your overall approach, and think other hiring managers would do well to emulate a variant, but point 3 seems to be a bit 'woo'. Could you provide some more detail (or examples) of how you build a required personality profile in advance?

I'm not sure what you mean exactly by, "woo", but I can provide a little bit of context. The most important thing to note is that this has proven only meaningful or useful to me in the context of all the other things I mentioned as well. It doesn't stand on its own, ever.

Mostly it's a framework for how to think about dimensions of the problem in the abstract. It's like "team architecture" analysis. I use the OCEAN trait model. I'm aware of it's limitations (and they are numerous), as well as those of other models and methods. The reason I use it is because it's a simple enough, but still rich enough, model for me to be able to partially apply on-the-fly through casual conversation, etc.

For me it breaks down roughly like:

1. I think about that job that I need done and plan traits that probably map to that job. The kind of expressed traits that surface in a fastidious-finisher are very rarely also the traits that surface in a cowboy-hacker (the coarseness of the caricatures is for illustration only).So there's a sketch that looks like: O-low, C-mid, E-NA, A-mid, N-low or something for any given need.

2. I plan out the set of traits that are mandatory to be expressed (or not expressed) strongly. Like it might be the case that I need someone to be super high on C, but if they're also super high on N, and being high on N is fairly undesirable for the current situation, then that warrants further exploration. The point of this is to try to help prioritize focus on what to assess, how to assess it, reasonable confidence in the assessment, and which dimensions are fine to be really fuzzy.

3. With model priorities in place, when speaking to people there are a lot of ways to prompt, leave empty airspace, and methods of story-telling that facilitate creating safer space for a broader spectrum of interaction than is often expected in a normal hirer-hiree dynamic. These help guide filling in that rudimentary sketch. Talking about almost anything other than the job itself helps with this because it's important to try to establish a peer-like posture. With a lot of practice one can get "okay" at doing this in such a way that it can be a meaningful, but incomplete, weight in the calculus on how to proceed with a candidate as well as the team the candidate would be joining.

4. Lastly, the most important thing to do here from my experience is to bias myself toward constantly trying to rapidly invalidate my model sketch at every possible stage of interaction from the first email exchange all the way up to issuing an offer. This does a few things. It forces me to have constant and active intention in every single step of the process and every single interaction with a person. It keeps me from religiously believing in the modelling itself because it's constantly clear that it's incomplete and fallible. Perhaps most important is that it puts the adversarial focus on myself and my assessment process rather than laying that adversarial relationship on the candidate.

I have to read as much or more about psychology and neuroscience as I do about byzantine fault-detection or applications of formal methods. Hiring can't be an afterthought that we as hiring-managers take lightly or try to relegate to passive tools or industry norms that seem patently ridiculous on their face.

Every "bad hire", every misaligned/unsatisfied employee, and every termination is ultimately the fault of management.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#188
Too bad they don't differentiate between AngularJS and Angular (2+), which are totally different frameworks. Would be interesting to compare Angular and React.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#189
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've recently been having issues with Sublime randomly freezing and restarting (may be due to a package, but I'm not going to waste my time verifying what packages are misbehaving out of the hundreds I have installed), I've gone back to Vim. After setting Vim up for multiple environments (PHP, Go, Python, and JavaScript) it's now my daily driver. Maybe other people feel similar?

> may be due to a package, but I'm not going to waste my time verifying what packages are misbehaving out of the hundreds I have installed Welcome to vim, but if you go overboard on plugins then you will have the same issues with it, probably more so.

I'm finding with Vim that less is more, or maybe as I become more experience I'm not relying so much on the GUI aspect of text editors (creating new files, git integration, color pickers, etc) but instead just sticking to the command line for a variety of operations.

Re: Developer Skills Report

#190

> Irrespective of your job, it will become important for everyone to learn how to code It strikes me that the person who wrote that is used to associating with technical people, and might spend a little more time in the real world. I work in a company of 100 ish people, 15 are delivery drivers. 40 odd are sales assistants that customers value for their detailed product knowledge. 4 are involved in cleaning of differe…

Do those sales people use complex spreadsheets? Are there major effeciency gains possible with a minor amount of scripting?

Depends on the role. But salespeople are there to sell stuff, the efficiency gains are orthogonal to the objective. Their job is to call people, go shake hands, get ink on dotted lines, etc. Not faff about with Excel.

Note: They also sell themselves to their bosses too. Hence why they tend to outlast engineers in largish orgs.

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