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CEOs Want Their Offices Back

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Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#181

Post by djsumdog »

ronnier wrote: post #18
coffeeski wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would take a 10% paycut to have a small office that fits 2 monitors, a filing cabinet and some pictures, rather then dealing with constant clattering of the guy behind me that decided converting a type writer into a digital keyboard was a good idea.

The mechanical keyboard people in open offices bother me.

I have had mechanical keyboards four different offices (1 cube, 3 open workspaces) and got very lucky with people either not minding or, at one company, a co-worker saying "that's music to my hears."

I've had a friend on the wrong floor at one company who had to switch to MX Browns with o-ring dampeners.

If a company banned me from using a mech keyboard entirely, I'd start looking for another job.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#182

Post by cmurf »

varelse wrote: post #139
LoSboccacc wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many large company will do but the large brunt of codetariat working for cash strapped business living and dying according to investors and customers will be keept in the open spaces: they looks cool in photos, convey a reassuring sense of "working bees" and sells well to visiting customers, so I fear the open plan it's here to stay.

HR is driven by data. To kill open floor plans, start citing the floor plan as the primary reason for leaving. If that becomes a theme, IMO open floor plans will become cancer. It just takes time.

If talent has to quit to get HR to grok anything, the cancer in the company is HR. And good luck citing that as the reason for quitting, and good luck expecting HR to grant permission for your manager to give you a good recommendation.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#183

Post by matchagaucho »

deepGem wrote: post #101
varelse wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just like the cargo cult Agile pandemic peaked a few years ago, I suspect we're reaching peak open floor plans right now. The overall negative effects of an open floor plan for a significant fraction of engineers (though not all) is self-evident and backed up by reams of data stretching back nearly 40 years: http://iansommerville.com/software-engineering-book/web/work... TLDR: 100 square feet of personal space is opt…

I worked at Sun Microsystems for a while and their private office layout was really nice. I can't ballpark the exact size but the office could hold 3 gigantic CRT monitors, 2 desk phones, and had space for 2 visitors. I feel that a 2 person private office is quite optimal, since we are talking about teams. It's easier to pair program or discuss and even maintain silence when required. Office designers will have to pa…

The irony is that we (FB) came in and demolished all those awesome Sun offices to create "open space".

No "Duke" mascots were harmed in the process, though :-)

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#184

Post by bshudi »

evadne wrote: post #155
meddlepal wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we can have our cake and eat it too. The all-glass office style at We Work could be adopted. I wish the glass was a bit thicker but the small shared office or bullpen model is ideal IMO.

I am currently working from a WeWork location and can provide a data point, that all-glass offices are terrible with soundproofing. The other downside of having glass partitions is that you could see what your neighbours were doing (and vice versa), which in my opinion is no different from visual pollution.

I am also at a WeWork location, but I find that the noise outside of our room is hardly noticed. That being said, I agree about the clear glass, I wish more of the glass was frosted.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#185

Post by brogrammernot »

varelse wrote: post #132
bogomipz wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>"Just like the cargo cult Agile pandemic peaked a few years ago, I suspect we're reaching peak open floor plans right now." Wait, that peaked? That hasn't been my perception. I'm curious where you are seeing that.

I'm not seeing anywhere near the $h!+storm of pointless standups I used to see every morning. I'm also seeing the return of the weekly status meeting. Give it time. Then again, I'm someone who's threatened to enact the 6 mph standup meeting wherein the second anyone drops below 6 mph on foot, the meeting's over because how can we practice Agile if we aren't agile? That wasn't received well.

Very rarely do I actually lol but I just chuckled so hard in a meeting.

Yeah, you guessed it. An agile meeting.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#186

Post by bluesnowmonkey »

jesseryoung wrote: post #103
valuearb wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What was your role on the team? Did your team-members enjoy you turning around and interrupting them? Is it really that hard to get up and walk to another office so you don't disturb 8 other people with a question they don't care about? Walking around occasionally in the day is actually good for us. And two person offices are a mild improvement over cubicles, which are a significant improvement over open offices. But…

I was a team lead/solutions architect. > Did your team-members enjoy you turning around and interrupting them? I don't think it's fair to call all conversations "interruptions" and my co-workers were all very conscious of causing any unwanted interruptions. > Is it really that hard to get up and walk to another office so you don't disturb 8 other people with a question they don't care about? It wasn't, and I often di…

> 99% of people had headphones on through all parts of the day.

Yes I've found that to be true as well. I myself typically wear expensive noise cancelling headphones all day and blast music, damaging my hearing, in order to drown out distractions. Fuck open offices.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#187

Post by bitmapbrother »

ronnier wrote: post #18
coffeeski wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would take a 10% paycut to have a small office that fits 2 monitors, a filing cabinet and some pictures, rather then dealing with constant clattering of the guy behind me that decided converting a type writer into a digital keyboard was a good idea.

The mechanical keyboard people in open offices bother me.

If you're going to use a mechanical keyboard in an open office have the courtesy to at least install dampeners.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#188

Post by coldcode »

jdc0589 wrote: post #87
jesseryoung wrote: post #50

It seems like when "Open Office" articles come out there seem to be quite a few people talking ill of them. I recently switched jobs and with it switched from an open concept (large room with whiteboards separating teams) to an office (shared with one other coworker.) Maybe I was conditioned to like it (I certainly didn't like it at first) but I really did prefer the open concept when working on a team of 8 or 9 peop…

This is why I actually like cubicles. you are physically close to your team, if your space is organized well you are on a common isle with people you work with, but you still have at least a little bit of isolation in your personal workspace. I DO NOT understand why cubes get so much hate.

I prefer cubes as long as they have 6ft walls or more. I once worked in a open plan where I had 12 sq ft of space. At least with carpet and walls you get some sound damping but can still ask hear what's going on if you need to.

Re: CEOs Want Their Offices Back

#189

Post by matchagaucho »

Ultimately, each team has its own optimal cadence that oscillates between face-to-face and secluded concentration.

Open space implies that cadence is "daily", but for workers who create intellectual property, that cadence is more realistically every 5-10 days.

The need for in-person "check and balance" varies with experience. I work with remote teams of Sr Engineers that meet in-person 1-2 times per year. Minimal communication issues.

But if apprentice-level Engineers are being groomed, then the frequency of in-person meetings needs to be daily/weekly/monthly.

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