CSS Grid – Table layout is back. Be there and be square

Post by recklessplayer » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 4:07 PM UTC

andybak wrote: post #92

return0 wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with screen readers is summarized "Screen readers assume the content inside a table is tabular". Are divs better just because they are undefined? It seems to me that the problem would more easily be solved by adding some attributes to skip tabular treatment or to add captions, rather than ditching tables altogether. Table elements like could even be used to identify and access parts of the UI pages.

> Screen readers assume the content inside a table is tabular I'm curious to hear from screen reader users. I recall that the gap between "what web developers think screen readers do" and "what screen readers do" has always been sizable.

Post by recursive » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 4:12 PM UTC

monk_e_boy wrote: post #130

dom0 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most divsoup-layouts are not semantic at all, either.

Exactly this. How are DIVs more semantic than TABLE? And who is reading the source? Your developers and a web spider. The web spider doesn't care (I wrote one and getting it to parse DIV content and TABLE content wasn't much effort) As far as I am aware no spider is looking at the DIV and gathering semantic information from it. Sure, it may look at the TABLE and initially assume it has tabular data in it, but a tiny…

Post by recursive » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 4:14 PM UTC

liveoneggs wrote: post #160

DavidSJ wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no problem. But sometime around 2003 it became trendy to do all layout in CSS, even when a table or a tag would do just fine.

was never even replaced properly :)

Post by colept » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 4:15 PM UTC

e12e wrote: post #72

This doesn't really fix much - if the idea is to continue to use pixel-based positioning. I've got devices with a range of dot-pitches (surface 4 pro, external older monitor, cellphone) - with various physical screen sizes -- A "150px sidebar" doesn't work the same across these devices - and more importantly, for a low-resolution 24" screen I'd probably want a similar 3" side-bar as for a "retina"-resolution 24" scre…

Post by diamondlovesyou » Tue, Jan 31, 2017, 4:30 PM UTC

tannhaeuser wrote: post #157

tinco wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Originally, it was not known that HTML pages would be so finely designed. It is not a naieve dichotomy, it is an attainable ideal that has had a very positive effect on the state of the web. We owe huge thanks to this movement that lead both to the demise of proprietary browser extensions (like flash) and to the awesome technologies in browsers today such as these CSS features, new HTML elements and transport protoco…

These things, while beneficial, don't owe their existence to CSS. Instead, introducing eg. CSS shapes or `content: ` (as two extreme examples) was the way of least resistance/guerilla tactics, as opposed to putting the functionality into SVG proper, or aligning the layout box model better with the DOM model, resp. Now what we're left with is a way overcomplicated mess for generations to clean up. There's a reason Moz…