Why people keep trying to erase the Hollywood sign from Google Maps (2014) • Hacker News Board

Re: Why people keep trying to erase the Hollywood sign from Google Maps (2014)

#181

Post by Lawtonfogle » Tue, Nov 10, 2015, 1:34 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #168

Lawtonfogle wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every law is backed by violence. A threat of legal action is a threat of violence, even if it is delayed. So instead of breaking knee caps, it is more like threatening to get a person who may charge them $500 and if they don't pay, then break their knee caps. There is a chance they won't do anything, but it is still a threat of violence.

No, in general, a threat of legal action might, if you want to take things to extremes, be a threat that, if you don't comply, the actor will attempt to secure an authorization from a third party (the judiciary) that would impose conditions under threat of violence, but it is not, in itself, a threat of violence, even delayed violence.

You cannot outright ignore the threat because there is a chance it could escalate. Any example you give, I could give a counter where I use some non-state certified violence (such as the mafia) that escalates in the same fashion, and it would be considered a threat backed by violence.

Re: Why people keep trying to erase the Hollywood sign from Google Maps (2014)

#182

Post by Lawtonfogle » Tue, Nov 10, 2015, 1:39 PM UTC

jarsin wrote: post #167

Lawtonfogle wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every law is backed by violence. A threat of legal action is a threat of violence, even if it is delayed. So instead of breaking knee caps, it is more like threatening to get a person who may charge them $500 and if they don't pay, then break their knee caps. There is a chance they won't do anything, but it is still a threat of violence.

Yes this is exactly what i was getting at. If you take the stance that every law is backed by violence essentially.. AND you now say you are going to use the law to get someone to stop doing something that is perfectly legal and OK such as posting a helpful blog on the internet... Then to me these people are no different from the types of people that threaten to harm you to get you to do what they want.

>AND you now say you are going to use the law to get someone to stop doing something that is perfectly legal

Why does it matter if it is legal? Illegal only means that the group in control at the time thinks violence is acceptable to stop the given illegal action.

For some actions there will be mass agreement, such as making murder illegal. For others, there often is far less agreement and maybe even mass disagreement, such as sodomy, which was illegal even into the beginning of the 21st century, or pot.

That the action is legal or not doesn't have much bearing on the underlying issue.

And just to be clear, anarchy isn't a solution because there will always be those wanting to use violence to enforce their will. So banding together and creating a stronger entity that has a monopoly on violence is the best option even if not a good one. Especially when you are a significant enough minority that the group doesn't care about your input or when the monopoly becomes corrupt and no longer follows the will of the group.

It is kinda like a predator out in nature. They have to kill to survive. Either their prey dies or they die. There is no solution where both can live.

Re: Why people keep trying to erase the Hollywood sign from Google Maps (2014)

#183

Post by stevetursi » Tue, Nov 10, 2015, 2:01 PM UTC

wanderingstan wrote: post #68

miclip wrote: post #60

Similar issue in Sausalito above the Bridge. Wolfback Ridge Rd is a publicly maintained road yet they have a gate and sign that says otherwise. It is strictly enforced by Sausalito Police on behalf of residents. There's some great short hikes up there that offer excellent views of the Golden Gate Bridge and headlands. Even google didn't dare go up there: https://www.google.com/maps/@37.8512481,-122.4911711,3a,75y,...…

Holy cow. Anyone want to organize a mass bike ride or hike there?

There are organized trail races in that area. Whenever I'm in the Bay Area I always look for races there. One of the most spectacular locales I've ever had the pleasure of being at. I'm always in the back of the pack but with those views, I don't mind so much.

Example with photos from a race I did there in 2013: http://stevetursi.blogspot.com/2013/09/rr-san-francisco-50-m...

Re: Why people keep trying to erase the Hollywood sign from Google Maps (2014)

#184

Post by aurelius12 » Wed, Nov 11, 2015, 8:23 PM UTC

miclip wrote: post #173

aurelius12 wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I emailed Jonathon Goldman, the Dir. of Public Works and got a response. He wrote: Good afternoon. Here's a short answer from MarinMap (attached). The pieces of roadway that have no zoning, are inside the City Limits (the red dashed line) and have no parcel boundaries crossing them are generally public right of way. Roads that transit parcels with a solid color (and are therefore not as visible on the attached), or h…

Same guy I spoke to. He said you could drive and access the trail head which is right where the fire trail for the Radio towers is, first sharp left turn. People still have issues doing that though. My wife reminded me this evening that she was confronted walking down the hill. It's nuts.

Wow. Well, I'm definitely heading over there to push the issue at some point. Fuck those guys.