Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Next Generation Bends Over

37signals.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

171–180 of 216 posts

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#171

Post by jasongullickson »

doki_pen wrote: post #161
jasongullickson wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" Fake revolutions are cute and all, but think of how awesome it would be to never ever have to work for the man again. " Selfish, short-sighted and immature...more words that describe the next generation.

Hmm.. People often forget the software is almost trivial compared to some of the worlds problems. What if you took your 50million and used it to help out hungry kids? Wouldn't it be better then trying to have some revolution around accounting software?

This is a slippery slope, but suffice to say that if Mint hung in there and took over Intuit's place in the marketplace not only would they be treating their customers better (you know, the ones who got them here in the first place?) but they would also have many more millions to feed children, etc.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#172

Post by jasongullickson »

fallentimes wrote: post #170
jasongullickson wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" Fake revolutions are cute and all, but think of how awesome it would be to never ever have to work for the man again. " Selfish, short-sighted and immature...more words that describe the next generation.

How's it selfish and short-sighted? And certainly that's better than making blanket statements about the next generation or having the gull to think a company is sparking a "revolution". That word is starting to become more overused than the word "celebrity".

Bear in mind I'm responding to the comment above my own, not the article itself.

"how awesome it would be to never ever have to work for the man again"

This quote outlines something that benefits the individual (self), as opposed to the many (Mint's existing customers), no?

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#173

Post by fallentimes »

jasongullickson wrote: post #172
fallentimes wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How's it selfish and short-sighted? And certainly that's better than making blanket statements about the next generation or having the gull to think a company is sparking a "revolution". That word is starting to become more overused than the word "celebrity".

Bear in mind I'm responding to the comment above my own, not the article itself. "how awesome it would be to never ever have to work for the man again" This quote outlines something that benefits the individual (self), as opposed to the many (Mint's existing customers), no?

Sure, out of context. And that doesn't mean it wouldn't be awesome :) You throw out a lot of insults and blanket statements without a lot of backing. Also, you're insinuating that it's selfish (and perhaps wrong?) to sell a company, which is just ridiculous.

It's funny you're nitpicking a quote when the original article is pretentious and what were your words "short sighted and immature" enough to call their own company a revolution.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#174

Post by Conservationist »

itgoon wrote: post #163
jacquesm wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> pay off close friends' debts Honorable, but basically flawed. Your relationship with your friends will change because of something like that, it is very very nice of you to want to share the wealth, but someone that has a sense of honour themselves will either have to refuse your offer or they will accept and it will hurt their sense about themselves. Should you ever find such wealth be very careful how you approac…

Your relationship with the people you know will change, regardless (been there, done that). Many of my long-time crowd are ecstatic to make $15/hr, and we still hang out on a regular basis. After a few mistakes, here's the tack I've learned to take. Treat everything you give as a gift. Don't expect _anything_ in return, and say so very clearly. This keeps you from giving more than you would like to, and prevents the…

If you have more of anything than other people, they want some of it and will use equality/friendship/politeness as a means of demanding it.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#175

Post by jasongullickson »

fallentimes wrote: post #173
jasongullickson wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bear in mind I'm responding to the comment above my own, not the article itself. "how awesome it would be to never ever have to work for the man again" This quote outlines something that benefits the individual (self), as opposed to the many (Mint's existing customers), no?

Sure, out of context. And that doesn't mean it wouldn't be awesome :) You throw out a lot of insults and blanket statements without a lot of backing. Also, you're insinuating that it's selfish (and perhaps wrong?) to sell a company, which is just ridiculous. It's funny you're nitpicking a quote when the original article is pretentious and what were your words "short sighted and immature" enough to call their own comp…

I think you're putting undeserved of weight on the term "revolution":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution

Regardless I don't see how your quote is "out of context"; I don't see anything in your original post that would indicate the sale benefits anyone other than the owners/executives of the company.

Your reply reflects precisely the attitude that the author of the article is calling out; that many founders set out to create a company for the sole purpose of selling out. The reason this is harmful is that in most cases the sale is to a company who is uninterested in the new, innovative ideas that the original founders incorporated in the product (the same qualities which drew in early adopters and other customers).

This has a negative effect on the overall progress of the industry involved as it prevents "big changes" (I'll try to avoid loaded terms) from happening and allows stagnation to continue.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#176

Post by yalurker »

doki_pen wrote: post #162
vijayr wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, not always. It becomes a business when 1) you charge interest 2) you have some terms and conditions or attach some "strings" 3) you require collateral 4) you make your friend sign papers, and you leave "legal" options open When I loan a friend, all I say is "dude, this is just to help you, I know you are going through tough times. No way this is to insult or patronize you. you can return the money when you can, e…

It's bullshit. Invariably lending money to a friend leads to resentment. You are putting a dollar amount on the friendship. If they don't pay you back, will you still be friends? if yes, then why not just give them the money?

False dichotomy. You don't have to say "we're not friends if you don't pay me back" but you can still want to be repaid. Who here hasn't loaned a friend a small sum of money? My friends and I are constantly in debts of 20 or 30 dollars to each other. I've had a friend/roommate owe me a month's rent without any problem. At no point were we every "putting a dollar amount on the friendship".

It's often a bad idea to mix friends and business/money. That doesn't mean it is always a bad idea.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#177

Post by fallentimes »

jasongullickson wrote: post #175
fallentimes wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, out of context. And that doesn't mean it wouldn't be awesome :) You throw out a lot of insults and blanket statements without a lot of backing. Also, you're insinuating that it's selfish (and perhaps wrong?) to sell a company, which is just ridiculous. It's funny you're nitpicking a quote when the original article is pretentious and what were your words "short sighted and immature" enough to call their own comp…

I think you're putting undeserved of weight on the term "revolution": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution Regardless I don't see how your quote is "out of context"; I don't see anything in your original post that would indicate the sale benefits anyone other than the owners/executives of the company. Your reply reflects precisely the attitude that the author of the article is calling out; that many founders set o…

Perhaps, but calling yourself a revolution is kind of like calling yourself insane or weird or unique or a celebrity; it's just disingenuous. If you have to call yourself something...

It's out of context because I wasn't saying to be "selfish" and do nothing. I was saying they could work on whatever they wanted regardless of whether or not it's monetizable. There's no way to know that without context.

>Many founders set out to create a company for the sole purpose of selling out (which in the author's context included Aaron).

You don't know that. Aaron could have set off to build a long-term profitable company, which they appeared [1] on their way to doing. But 170 million dollars is 170 million dollars. Almost everyone has their number especially if they have shareholders and vested employees (which 37s does). Their responsibility isn't just to their customers, but to their shareholders, employees, vendors and other people in their life. Who's to say their customers will be treated worse because of the acquisition (granted, Intuit has a poor track record, but this thread has enough assuming in it already).

You run in to the same problem as the OP does: a lot of assumptions without any real knowledge of Aaron or the company's dealings. Instead you're relying on blind assertions and tunnel vision to judge others.

[1] Based on lead gen affiliate fees and the amount of users they had. Unfortunately I don't know this for sure.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#178

Post by jasongullickson »

fallentimes wrote: post #177
jasongullickson wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're putting undeserved of weight on the term "revolution": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolution Regardless I don't see how your quote is "out of context"; I don't see anything in your original post that would indicate the sale benefits anyone other than the owners/executives of the company. Your reply reflects precisely the attitude that the author of the article is calling out; that many founders set o…

Perhaps, but calling yourself a revolution is kind of like calling yourself insane or weird or unique or a celebrity; it's just disingenuous. If you have to call yourself something... It's out of context because I wasn't saying to be "selfish" and do nothing. I was saying they could work on whatever they wanted regardless of whether or not it's monetizable. There's no way to know that without context. >Many founders…

You're right about that fact that neither I nor the author of the article know everything (perhaps anything?) about the genuine motivation or inner-workings of Mint's owners and operators.

In my case I was referring to startups/founders in general which I thought I made clear by the terms I chose in my response, however if this was ambiguous to you I apologize.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#179

Post by vijayr »

doki_pen wrote: post #162
vijayr wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, not always. It becomes a business when 1) you charge interest 2) you have some terms and conditions or attach some "strings" 3) you require collateral 4) you make your friend sign papers, and you leave "legal" options open When I loan a friend, all I say is "dude, this is just to help you, I know you are going through tough times. No way this is to insult or patronize you. you can return the money when you can, e…

It's bullshit. Invariably lending money to a friend leads to resentment. You are putting a dollar amount on the friendship. If they don't pay you back, will you still be friends? if yes, then why not just give them the money?

Its just like borrowing your friend's car. You use it for a weekend, and return it back, don't you? Does your friend take "deposit money" from you for it? Does he charge you "rent" for using his car? No. That is the difference between your friend and a rental car company.

You are putting a dollar amount on the friendship

Nope, I am not. All I am saying is, if I am in a better position than my friend, and he needs help, I am willing to help. He has to borrow money from someone anyway, why not from me, interest free and trouble free? He can sleep peacefully at night, knowing that I wont foreclose his house or something, if he is going to be late in repaying, or even if he is not able to repay at all.

If they don't pay you back, will you still be friends?

Yes. We are talking of FU money here, and also assuming that I am in a situation like Mint founders. I am in a position to loan money, without affecting my own lifestyle. Obviously, if I am myself living paycheck to paycheck, this won't apply.

why not just give them the money?

because, I don't want to patronize them, and don't want to insult them.

Frankly, I don't understand why you call this bullshit. Loaning money to friends happens all the time. I've done it many times, and have always been repaid.

Re: The Next Generation Bends Over

#180

Post by [deleted] »

jasongullickson wrote: post #178
fallentimes wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps, but calling yourself a revolution is kind of like calling yourself insane or weird or unique or a celebrity; it's just disingenuous. If you have to call yourself something... It's out of context because I wasn't saying to be "selfish" and do nothing. I was saying they could work on whatever they wanted regardless of whether or not it's monetizable. There's no way to know that without context. >Many founders…

You're right about that fact that neither I nor the author of the article know everything (perhaps anything?) about the genuine motivation or inner-workings of Mint's owners and operators. In my case I was referring to startups/founders in general which I thought I made clear by the terms I chose in my response, however if this was ambiguous to you I apologize.

[deleted]
Post reply on HN