The origins of this survey need to be audited and investigated. Some school districts are notoriously greedy and only care about their bottom-line: test scores. The higher scores, the more money (for the district and for their salaries). I'm sure they correlated drug habits with low test scores, and sought to extradite delinquents from their schools. Perhaps even a precursor to this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School-to-prison_pipeline
Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
171–180 of 202 posts
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's copyrighted information. How much could be released under "fair use" is questionable. Schools abuse copyright in some ways, and probably compensate by being rigorous in others. Further, if it comes from a company that also offers more conventional achievement kinds of tests, it may come with bloodthirsty NDAs, as a matter of habit for such companies.
So what? The school can give copies to students. Why can they not give one of those copies to a parent or reporter? Copyright does not stop you from giving a copy to someone, it only stops you from making more copies.
Sort-of. If the copies came with a license agreement forbidding you giving a copy to the press, then you might be liable if you did.
Furthermore if members of the press got a copy, they might be forbidden from publishing the test in full. A sample single question from the test (alluding to illegal activity) would likely be fair-use.
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don't actually have the right to provide false answers in many situations and doing so could actually be a crime.
I heard somewhere that lying to police is punishable by something like three years in jail in the US. Unless you killed someone or are a repeat offender, lying may well get you a harsher sentence than your original crime. And of course, it's very easy to lie accidentally: You may honestly be confused, mis-remember, make a mistake, or tell them a true fact that doesn't fit with incorrect information they obtained from…
Also silence can be taken for assent if you don't explicitly invoke your right to silence. Just not answering isn't good enough sigh.
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
I'm not positive but very confident. These surveys are not anonymous, says the article. School administrators are required to adhere to the zero tolerance policy to the letter.
I think you are mistaken. When I was in public school, "zero tolerance" policies applied to what you do in school.
I also went to FCPS and they did only apply to "in school" but "in school" was very broad (all school-related activities, on the way to/from school).
Other school districts can and have applied their codes of conduct to non-school related activities.
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
There is a public hearing tomorrow night and I plan on attending. That's awesome. This is what democracy looks like. I got hooked attending some townhalls on my pet topic. I've learned so much about politics, policy, etc. these last 8 years. #1 Show up. #2 Keep showing up. #3 Bring your friends. It's ridiculous how few people shape policy. The upside is adding a few more people to the debate can significantly shape o…
Interesting. Who else shows up? Do local corporations send representatives and "experts"? What is the average profile of attendees?
Depends on the issue.
For election integrity, it was a small group of us vs everyone else. I've testified opposite Mark Radke of Diebold, county auditors, county executives, election administrators, retired generals, people representing the disabled community, etc.
One time, our issue followed the kittens and puppies on the agenda. Something about a kennel. Council was PACKED. EVERYONE showed up for the puppies and kittens.
Whereas it was just me and my cohort representing the interests of democracy. Looking at the turnout for the puppies and kittens, I turned to my cohort and said "We're doing this wrong."
The times we "won", it was either because we packed the hearing or I had better (embarrassing) information.
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#176Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Never blame on malice what can be blamed on incompetence. So, does the early bird get the worm or do good things come to those who wait? We're maybe too inclined to just assert these sorts of things as fact. (This includes me.)
Except this piece of wisdom is extremely valid. Assuming everybody else is both supremely competent and consistently malicious goes against most people's experience. You give humanity far too much credit by assuming everyone is an evil mastermind.
On the other hand, assuming everyone is an evil incompetent...
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
So what? The school can give copies to students. Why can they not give one of those copies to a parent or reporter? Copyright does not stop you from giving a copy to someone, it only stops you from making more copies.
Sort-of. If the copies came with a license agreement forbidding you giving a copy to the press, then you might be liable if you did. Furthermore if members of the press got a copy, they might be forbidden from publishing the test in full. A sample single question from the test (alluding to illegal activity) would likely be fair-use.
"Sort-of. If the copies came with a license agreement forbidding you giving a copy to the press, then you might be liable if you did."
Except that you do not need a license unless you are making copies. The only reason you see licenses with software is that the process of installing software is making a copy of that software. Books do not come with licenses, because you do not copy a book in order to read it.
"Furthermore if members of the press got a copy, they might be forbidden from publishing the test in full."
I am pretty sure that even a full reproduction in a newspaper could be fair use, since it is for purely journalistic purposes and the publishing of the questionnaire would not impact the market in any way (the scrutiny by the press might, but criticism is also covered by fair use).
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don't actually have the right to provide false answers in many situations and doing so could actually be a crime.
I heard somewhere that lying to police is punishable by something like three years in jail in the US. Unless you killed someone or are a repeat offender, lying may well get you a harsher sentence than your original crime. And of course, it's very easy to lie accidentally: You may honestly be confused, mis-remember, make a mistake, or tell them a true fact that doesn't fit with incorrect information they obtained from…
Well, they don't tend to prosecute that harshly. There are examples of people committing murder and telling the strangest most egregious lies you could imagine and getting nothing at all done to me. See Casey Anthony. Sure, the only thing that happened to her was like a little probation for her lies but those amounted to lies bigger than I could imagine a reasonable person telling the police with a straight face.
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#179The teacher should be in hot water for teaching the 5th amendment incorrectly. From the text of the amendment: "No person shall be... compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself..." The 5th amendment gives people the right to refuse to testify, as a witness , in a way that might incriminate oneself. Relatedly, it excludes self-incriminating statements in certain circumstances from evidence in crimi…
Well, but the fact is you are never compelled to incriminate yourself. So I think your distinction is without a difference here. The teacher informed the children, who are not lawyers by the way, they do not have to incriminate themselves. I think your distinction is true in a pedantic sense but I think this was a correct interpretation of what you are not compelled to do.
Re: Teacher under fire for informing kids of their Fifth Amendment rights
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think you are mistaken. When I was in public school, "zero tolerance" policies applied to what you do in school.
I also went to FCPS and they did only apply to "in school" but "in school" was very broad (all school-related activities, on the way to/from school). Other school districts can and have applied their codes of conduct to non-school related activities.
Indeed it was, and I was in school when it became that broad. I even wrote about it in the school newspaper. But I still have not heard of a school that says "You used alcohol over the weekend in an activity that we agree is completely unrelated to school, so we will expel you."