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A Difficult Situation

blog.sendgrid.com

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Re: A Difficult Situation

#171

Post by mtrimpe »

seivan wrote: post #150
powertower wrote: post #98

They need to update that statement with the fact that the joke was not about her, nor directed at her. Their statement leaves that very important part out, making the reader think otherwise - that she was the victim. At the same time (or around that time) this was happening, here is a conversation she was having - http://i.imgur.com/nRC5J7f.png Another gem from years ago - http://imgur.com/5tbXR2c I'd imagine she was…

Exactly, just two guys making forking jokes (get it?). Even Github sells merch with the words "Fork you". Zealous oversensitive jaded person like her, taking her time to get the phone out, take a picture, possible geo-tagged of two guys who might not want to be on her Twitter. She has no right to do that. Especially when there was no communication between them. You don't like their jokes, tell them or move away. Look…

Do you know Adria personally?

Saying that "We got an unstable, hypocritical, oversensitive jaded person out of our way. I think this was a win." without knowing her personally would be ... well ... not exactly OK.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#172

Post by abalone »

Does anyone remember the ApacheCon Noirin Shirley / Florian Leibert scandal from a few years back, where she wrote a blog post accusing him of sexual assault at a conference party?

So would SendGrid FIRE Shirley for resorting to "publicly shaming" him in a blog post, if she had a public role in the company? Would her blog post be in violation of PyCon conference policy?

To be 100% clear, I'm not suggesting the dongle joke rises to the level of sexual assault. But the general policy against "public shaming" that's being put in place here for PyCon, and as a fireable offense at companies like SendGrid, doesn't stop at dick jokes.

What do you think, could this prohibition against "public shaming" have a chilling effect on victims' right to speak out?

Re: A Difficult Situation

#173

Post by bluehat »

subsystem wrote: post #18

In my opinion he's a coward that doesn't stand behind his employees and that goes for PlayHaven too. They've set a terrible precedent for the industry.

She obviously is not doing a good job at generating positive PR for Sendgrid. For her, this makes sense.

PlayHaven though? Yeah, I lost a lot of respect for them.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#174

Post by devilshaircut »

jennyjenjen wrote: post #156
devilshaircut wrote: post #12

I applaud SendGrid's response to this debacle. It is carefully weighed and expresses the precise reason why action absolutely needed to be taken. It is worthy of praise that they are willing to step into a very controversial issue and do what is best for their employees despite the potential fallout. I encourage anyone who was considering not using SendGrid's services in light of recent events to reconsider, given th…

I just wish they had started out with this statement instead of abruptly announcing her firing. That just seemed uncharacteristic of SendGrid and rather inappropriate. However, you're very right in that it was a reasoned, rational response. It's tough to argue what Jim Franklin laid down in that post.

True, I do agree with you that the order of events seemed a bit tactless.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#175

Post by rdl »

donohoe wrote: post #162
mtrimpe wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike when he very publicly fired an employee in the heat of the moment after his company was being DDoS'ed. I think the fact that Paul Graham, after applying Occam's razor, preferred to think it was done from a compromised account speaks volumes here.

{{citation needed}} or put it another way - you're making a very reaching unsupported statement. You have no idea what they were thinking.

pg actually did point out that he thought the initial statement was fake, and that maybe someone had hacked multiple channels.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5416979

His sin there is having higher expectations of people than are justified by reality, which is hardly the worst thing to be guilty of.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#176

Post by _delirium »

incongruity wrote: post #160
eridius wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can people please stop bringing up that tweet? It has absolutely nothing to do with what happened at PyCon. Whatever she says on her own personal twitter feed is wholly unrelated to what happens at a professional event. Especially since the only people who see her tweet are people that have explicitly chosen to do so (either by following her or by following someone's link to it). What is acceptable in an opt-in scena…

>Whatever she says on her own personal twitter feed is wholly unrelated to what happens at a professional event. Except: A) She posted the picture in question on that twitter feed and B) She identifies herself as affiliated with her (former) employer at the top of that feed/in her profile. To me, those make her "personal" feed not so personal and wholly germane to this conversation.

Lots of people do that. I identify the university I work at in my twitter profile. Obviously I do not tweet on behalf of my university; it's just a way of describing what I do in my day job. Sometimes I tweet negative things about people. It's just words; you know, people talking to other people. Sometimes they even do it in public, like we're doing right here.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#177

Post by DivisibleByZero »

A seriously impressive email. As many before me have stated this is a bad situation for SendGrid and I wasn't sure if firing their employee was a good move on their part. This post does a wonderful job addressing everything it needs to in a concise, and appropriate way. Kudos to SendGrid for the wondrous job navigating a very sticky situation.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#178

Post by Yver »

arrrg wrote: post #115
midge1b wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, she was fired because "she can no longer be effective in her role at SendGrid". Which makes sense, considering her role was to strengthen developer relations...

I do not disagree with you that the statement also named that as a reason for firing her. All I’m saying that if the DDoS played any part in their decision to fire her, then that part of the justification for their decision represents immoral cowardice to me.

named that? Which part? I think you're perceiving things that are not there.

Re: A Difficult Situation

#179

Post by AJ007 »

adanto6840 wrote: post #163
eridius wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can people please stop bringing up that tweet? It has absolutely nothing to do with what happened at PyCon. Whatever she says on her own personal twitter feed is wholly unrelated to what happens at a professional event. Especially since the only people who see her tweet are people that have explicitly chosen to do so (either by following her or by following someone's link to it). What is acceptable in an opt-in scena…

I unfortunately don't have time to expand on this right now, but I definitely disagree with you on this. In the current day & age, for better or worse, you have to be very acutely aware of your "surroundings" -- that includes what you post on any social media website, and especially if you explicitly name your employer. IMO, and again, for better or worse, this does currently apply to both personal and business accou…

Agreed. And was she not at the event in an official capacity?

If someone's job is to be a public figure or spokesperson for a given company then everything they do publicly online is relevant (I'm a huge advocate of using pseudonyms and anonymous communication online over personally identifiable communication.)

Re: A Difficult Situation

#180

Post by BlackJack »

donohoe wrote: post #162
mtrimpe wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unlike when he very publicly fired an employee in the heat of the moment after his company was being DDoS'ed. I think the fact that Paul Graham, after applying Occam's razor, preferred to think it was done from a compromised account speaks volumes here.

{{citation needed}} or put it another way - you're making a very reaching unsupported statement. You have no idea what they were thinking.

    We're assuming these are fake, and that someone just got hold of their Facebook and Twitter passwords.
pg posted that earlier. Source: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5416979
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