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Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

blog.mozilla.org

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Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#171

Post by zkmon »

USA entities tend to think that terms like "privacy", "security" have same meanings and assumptions across the globe, and that the USA laws are universal. Maybe they also think that entire world is just as dumb or dumber than USA.

For a start, you should consider this fact: Privacy for a bad actor goes directly against the security for citizens and good actors.

So when you talk about privacy you are making an assumption that it is contributing to safety. But for whom? Bad actors or good actors? Without such qualification, you are just talking lofy-sounding but meaningless ideals.

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#172

Post by phatfish »

pretzel5297 wrote: post #74

[flagged]

I will do everything in my power to keep the tech bros out of my children's life. Yes, that includes being a responsible parent. It also includes societal norms being established. Just as was done for alcohol, nicotine, movies, porn mags ect.

I guarantee you are not as dedicated as me trying to protect my kids, so there will be age gates, and that includes VPNs.

Everyone knows VPNs are only used for getting shit for free, so there is also a pretty powerful corporate interest to lock them down. In the case of the "corporate content provides" vs the "tech bros", the enemy of my enemy is my friend, I'll take a win however it comes.

Mozilla have picked a battle that will kill off Firefox, I am now not longer interested in recommending or using it. I'd bet their user base skews to older people, more likely to be parents.

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#173

Post by ihsw »

freedomben wrote: post #164
pretzel5297 wrote: post #74

[flagged]

While I agree with your comment at a high level, simply saying it's the parents job k thx bai is not going to cut it. Parents have to have the tools we need to do our jobs. I don't want the government touching it with a 10 foot pole, and no adults should have to give up their freedoms (these kids will be adults some day after all, so even if we're doing it "for the kids" we need to consider the world we're building f…

[dead]

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#174

Post by soco »

iamnothere wrote: post #116
miki123211 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm against any kind of age verification legislation, but this is a really bad argument. It doesn't answer the question of "what do we do about parents that don't do their job properly." In theory, one could implement age verification by negligent parent imprisonment, in practice, I don't think that would work, and definitely not in all cases. If we accept the premise that children having unfettered access to the int…

“Properly” is the choice of the parent, except in some narrow cases we’ve defined culturally. The last thing we need is society deciding in detail how children should be raised. CPS horror stories are bad enough as it is.

Nevertheless as a society we do have laws protecting the children, also the adults, on the streets. Why not having or applying laws for the online? Why should we expect or ask that the internet be magically better handled by the parents alone?

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#175

Post by phatfish »

notrealyme123 wrote: post #122
pretzel5297 wrote: post #74

[flagged]

Not to be to overly reductive, but you could use the same argument for drugs and weapons.

It's not being reductive at all. I'm certain parent commentor doesn't have kids so they don't care. If someone was using the street outside their house to deal drugs and causing problems they would be happy for the police to "regulate" that activity.

It's just selfishness. "I want some privacy utopia on the internet (which can no longer exist, the internet isn't the place of the 90s and early 00s), so your kids can be exploited by social media and porn".

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#176

Post by ihsw »

iamnothere wrote: post #116
miki123211 wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm against any kind of age verification legislation, but this is a really bad argument. It doesn't answer the question of "what do we do about parents that don't do their job properly." In theory, one could implement age verification by negligent parent imprisonment, in practice, I don't think that would work, and definitely not in all cases. If we accept the premise that children having unfettered access to the int…

“Properly” is the choice of the parent, except in some narrow cases we’ve defined culturally. The last thing we need is society deciding in detail how children should be raised. CPS horror stories are bad enough as it is.

CPS horror stories should be the least of your concern.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980s-1990s_Romanian_orphans_p...

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#178

Post by [deleted] »

freedomben wrote: post #164
pretzel5297 wrote: post #74

[flagged]

While I agree with your comment at a high level, simply saying it's the parents job k thx bai is not going to cut it. Parents have to have the tools we need to do our jobs. I don't want the government touching it with a 10 foot pole, and no adults should have to give up their freedoms (these kids will be adults some day after all, so even if we're doing it "for the kids" we need to consider the world we're building f…

[deleted]

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#179

Post by philipallstar »

soco wrote: post #174
iamnothere wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Properly” is the choice of the parent, except in some narrow cases we’ve defined culturally. The last thing we need is society deciding in detail how children should be raised. CPS horror stories are bad enough as it is.

Nevertheless as a society we do have laws protecting the children, also the adults, on the streets. Why not having or applying laws for the online? Why should we expect or ask that the internet be magically better handled by the parents alone?

Because online is global, and you can't have effective local laws against a global system. Parents don't need magic; they just need to watch what their kids use devices for, and keep the devices in public areas of the house.

The main thing the state can do is stop requiring kids to have portable internet-connected devices for state schooling.

Re: Mozilla to UK regulators: VPNs are essential privacy and security tools

#180

Post by philipallstar »

zimpenfish wrote: post #129
amazingamazing wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does UK not have equivalent to CPS?

We do - https://learning.nspcc.org.uk/child-protection-system - but, at least in England, as with most governmental functions, it's been slashed to near death by years of austerity and "small government" lunacy.

It's not lunacy. It's the parents' child, not the state's.
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