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Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

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Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#171

Post by rudhdb773b »

scotty79 wrote: post #152
echelon wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here are just some of the things you can do with tracking: - Dox, coerce, blackmail, and ruin political candidates, powerful CEOs, and wealthy people. If they watch a category of porn that is embarrassing or have an affair, suddenly you have leverage against them. You can parlay that to accomplish lots of things. - Make it impossible to talk about certain things and eventually eliminate those things. Porn today, abor…

> ruin political candidates, powerful CEOs, and wealthy people This is mostly fantasy propagated by works of fiction. In the real world release of any evidence of sins has practically zero impact on the wealthy people and when it very occasionally does have an impact it just happens in cases of people who weren't wealthy enough for the circumstances.

The government can do a whole lot more than embarrass CEOs and powerful people they don't like. Look at how China controls its tech CEOs by making them disappear until their views align.

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#172

Post by renewiltord »

txrx0000 wrote: post #151

We have to separate child protection from Internet control so that the "protect the kids" narrative loses its potency. So here's a counter-narrative: we can implement digital child protection without Internet-wide access control, and it requires just 3 simple features that can be implemented in less than a week. There's no need to introduce new laws at all. This could just be done tomorrow if there is genuine will to…

[flagged]

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#173

Post by scott_paul »

echelon wrote: post #145
wakawaka28 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about gutting moderation. They want you to dox yourself to get online. It's a pro-censorship authoritarian-friendly move. I don't believe the narrative that Meta is behind it all either. If they are, they are probably serving someone else.

Here are just some of the things you can do with tracking: - Dox, coerce, blackmail, and ruin political candidates, powerful CEOs, and wealthy people. If they watch a category of porn that is embarrassing or have an affair, suddenly you have leverage against them. You can parlay that to accomplish lots of things. - Make it impossible to talk about certain things and eventually eliminate those things. Porn today, abor…

I disagree with almost all of your political opinions, and some of your positions I very much hate. But we should be free to have the argument, without the thread of handcuffs or the threat of starvation. Although I use my real name here, sometimes I prefer not to, and that should be allowed.

The right to actual real privacy is the same thing as the right to actual real freedom of speech, and we should harm anyone who is trying to take that most basic foundation of all rights away.

I agree with Alexander Solzhenitsyn.

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#174

Post by a-dub »

pembrook wrote: post #162
a-dub wrote: post #95

how about if i do nothing the internet assumes i'm a child and therefore does not track me, show me ads or permit doom scroll feeds. then if i want i can jump through some hoops and pay some money or something to get a digital id that lets me attach a zkp to all my http requests that then unlock the magic of ads, tracking and doom scroll feeds. seems like a good plan to me.

That would be a solution if the people pushing this actually cared about "protecting kids." But let's be honest, governments want a dragnet they can use to monitor/control all internet communication. The people running western democracies are equally as power hungry and zealously authoritarian (my ideas will bring utopia!) as the people running the CCP. The only difference is, the CCP has permissionless authority, so…

i'm only half joking. adding zkps to http requests is probably the correct privacy preserving technical solution that could be built into something sensible.

the bigger issue is that lawmakers are thinking in terms of smartphones, tablets and commercial pcs as shrink wrapped media consumption devices with a setup step... not protocol level support that preserves parts of computing and the internet they don't even really know exists. seems like the ietf should have lobbyists or something.

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#176

Post by gruez »

gosub100 wrote: post #120
gruez wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>we simply can't pretend that there isn't rampant CSA by those in power, because we've had proof of it despite their best efforts What's "rampant"? The news coverage provides no shortage of people, but ringing off 100 (or whatever) people that are in the files doesn't say much, even if we make the questionable assumption that inclusion in files implies guilt. I'm sure that everyone would prefer the amount of pedophil…

The resistance to the release of the files including redactions and outright refusal of Congressional order is enough to reveal the magnitude of what's going on. I would even dare say this Iran war is in part due to blackmail gained on DJT.

>The resistance to the release of the files including redactions and outright refusal of Congressional order is enough to reveal the magnitude of what's going on.

I agree this makes him look suspect, but it's hardly conclusive. Moreover Democrats did a similar U-turn a few years before. The only difference is that they weren't bombastically pushing the conspiracy theory during the election campaign, which made it easier for them to backtrack later.

>When Maxwell was charged in 2020, Democrats continued to push for transparency. [...] After Biden took office in 2021, Democrats appeared to dial back their public calls for Epstein records’ release.

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2025/8/6/fact-check-did-democ...

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#177

Post by timschmidt »

rdevilla wrote: post #170
echelon wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't give up! If you think the heat has started, you're mistaken. We're not even in the fire yet. It can and will get waaaay worse. We've been able to push back against these efforts time and time again. Don't stop. Call your legislators. Talk with your friends and get them to do the same. Vote against politicians that support it. It does work.

Whatever you think the scale of surveillance is, I assure you it is 100x worse. North America is rooted. There is no recovery plan.

My understanding is that Abraham Lincoln literally had all the nation's telegraph lines routed through DC during the civil war, and AT&T has been an honorary branch of the US government ever since.

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#178

Post by signalfour »

simonask wrote: post #149
abcde666777 wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, I don't disagree with the sentiment of keeping trans ideology away from kids, in exactly the way I'd want to protect them from any kind of religious indoctrination.

The idea that even a single person in the world is trans because of "trans ideology" is what's absolutely insane here. If you think you could be convinced by anyone that you're not living out your true gender identity, I have news for you... Most people, children too, are not having those thoughts unless there's actually a journey waiting for them.

Is it really insane? In the detrans community, it's not uncommon for people to see their transition as ideologically led, see e.g. https://lacroicsz.substack.com/p/by-any-other-name.

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#179

Post by rdevilla »

timschmidt wrote: post #177
rdevilla wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whatever you think the scale of surveillance is, I assure you it is 100x worse. North America is rooted. There is no recovery plan.

My understanding is that Abraham Lincoln literally had all the nation's telegraph lines routed through DC during the civil war, and AT&T has been an honorary branch of the US government ever since.

That tradition was carried into the modern era.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Room_641A

Re: Do Not Turn Child Protection into Internet Access Control

#180

Post by tzs »

txrx0000 wrote: post #151

We have to separate child protection from Internet control so that the "protect the kids" narrative loses its potency. So here's a counter-narrative: we can implement digital child protection without Internet-wide access control, and it requires just 3 simple features that can be implemented in less than a week. There's no need to introduce new laws at all. This could just be done tomorrow if there is genuine will to…

So basically parents set the child's age and apps rely on that if they need to know if the user is old enough?

That's pretty similar to the California bill. Parents set an age when creating a child's account. The OS provides an API to get the user's age bracket from that, which apps that need to know the age bracket of the user can call.

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