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Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

discuss.ai.google.dev

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Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#171

Post by aseipp »

jacquesm wrote: post #133
NewsaHackO wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the issue is the same as Anthropic. They do charge for it though their API. The users, however, want to use the discounted "unlimited" flat rate through the first-party app instead, then get mad when they are told they have to use the same API every other third-party app does.

No, the problem is that the discounted rate exists in the first place. Essentially these are unfair business practices, product cross subsidization to ensure market dominance. See also: Microsoft and a whole bunch of other companies. And once they've got their monopoly position there is inevitably the rug-pull. I wonder if some CPO somewhere actually had the guts to put a 'rug pull' item on the product roadmap.

"PAYGO API access" vs "Monthly Tool Subscription" is just a matter of different unit economics; there's nothing particularly unusual or strange about the idea on its own, specific claims against Google notwithstanding.

Of course, Google is still in the wrong here for instantly nuking the account instead of just billing them for API usage instead (largely because an autoban or whatever easier, I'm sure).

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#172

Post by gmerc »

It's the old playbook again. They're using massive money to distort the market until the competition is bled dry while also operating the platform and using signal from the platform to target their competitors, classic DMA violation really. This all boils down to Chinese vendors getting banned from the market for "national security reasons" because if not, this all dies in a fire for Google investors. Nothing a gold pixel phone to the right places can't fix

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#173

Post by YetAnotherNick »

jacquesm wrote: post #133
NewsaHackO wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the issue is the same as Anthropic. They do charge for it though their API. The users, however, want to use the discounted "unlimited" flat rate through the first-party app instead, then get mad when they are told they have to use the same API every other third-party app does.

No, the problem is that the discounted rate exists in the first place. Essentially these are unfair business practices, product cross subsidization to ensure market dominance. See also: Microsoft and a whole bunch of other companies. And once they've got their monopoly position there is inevitably the rug-pull. I wonder if some CPO somewhere actually had the guts to put a 'rug pull' item on the product roadmap.

Just because all you can eat buffet exists doesn't mean that the food is free or you can take away the food. The food exists in discounted rate only if you consider it unlimited food. For normal folks they make profit.

Claude code could possibly make profit because the average usage doesn't come close to exhausting the limits.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#174

Post by joshuamorton »

jacquesm wrote: post #123
qmarchi wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Disclaimer: Former Googler Yeah they do. There's an entire mesh of metrics that are used to calculate your relation to separate accounts. It's the confidence tolerance that keeps you and your partner from getting banned together.

> There's an entire mesh of metrics that are used to calculate your relation to separate accounts. > It's the confidence tolerance that keeps you and your partner from getting banned together. Thanks for that bit of info, the degree of disgusting that google would be tracking who people's partners are is off the scale invasive and should be a reason for an immediate complaint to the various data privacy authorities.

I think you're vastly misunderstanding that comment.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#176

Post by nucleative »

bethekind wrote: post #15

This is draconian. > Our investigation specifically confirmed that the use of your credentials within the third-party tool “open claw” for testing purposes constitutes a violation of the Google Terms of Service [1]. This is due to the use of Antigravity servers to power a non-Antigravity product. I must be transparent and inform you that, in accordance with Google’s policy, this situation falls under a zero tolerance…

I cannot de-Google fast enough.

So if I ask Google's AI studio the wrong question, I might get my G-drive, Gmail, API access, Play store, YouTube channel, "login with Google" tokens, and more all ripped away instantly with no recourse?

No thanks

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#177

Post by gck1 »

dev1ycan wrote: post #154
gck1 wrote: post #149

I don't understand how this can be enforced without ridiculous levels of false positives. I'm truly baffled. The same with Claude Code situation. gemini-cli, claude-code, codex etc, they ALL have a -p flag or equivalent, which is non-interactive IO interface for their LLM inference. If I wire my tooling (or openclaw) to use the -p flag (or equivalents), is that allowed? Okay, maybe they get rid of the -p flag and I h…

Every subscription's profitability stands on people forgetting to unsubscribe, how is this surprising?

They're in the wrong business then. They're selling peak automation software, with the sales pitch of 'have AI do your work while you sleep'.

Are they banning their core offering? Are Ralph' loops also banned for building software? Because I can drain my quota with a simple bash loop faster than any OpenClaw instance.

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#178

Post by NewsaHackO »

wyre wrote: post #160
NewsaHackO wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>OpenAI and the Chinese companies let you all you can eat openly. You say this, but I guarantee that when they do offer a plan similar to Google/Anthropic's dedicated coding "unlimited" subscription, they will do the exact same thing. Maybe they will let OpenClaw in as a first party because of their partnership with the creator.

hmm? openAI has a $200 subscription too. https://chatgpt.com/explore/pro

Reread my post again

Re: Google restricting Google AI Pro/Ultra subscribers for using OpenClaw

#180

Post by randallsquared »

avazhi wrote: post #27

Google deciding to willy nilly unilaterally ban my 20+ year old primary Google account is probably my greatest internet fear, given how famously awful their support is. Seems like it's the singular best example of a tech company so big that through some combination of internal silos and TOS bureaucracy you have no shot of getting your account back, no matter how unreasonable the ban actually is. A while back I made c…

This is a major reason I haven't worked with Gemini much. Too many eggs in that basket to mess with it. Anthropic and OpenAI at least have no other baggage for me.
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