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Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

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Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#171

Post by wolvoleo »

ncallaway wrote: post #163
RyanOD wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel this way about many such networks. We avoid networked appliances, garage doors, door locks, external cameras, etc as often as we can.

I've gotta say, I'm at my absolute most smug when the internet is out and my Roku TV warns me "Are you sure you want to open Jellyfin, it probably won't work without internet access".

You're lucky, a fire tv stick just locks you into a "your internet is down so you're screwed" screen that you can't get out of when if you have Plex installed.

Yeah I should know better than to buy Amazon crap I know

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#172

Post by hackable_sand »

ncallaway wrote: post #162
stalfosknight wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So they'd rather lie in their press release.

Yes. That's...not unusual. I would strongly to advise you to assume companies are extremely willing to lie in press releases.

Right, but we have to call it out every time.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#173

Post by noduerme »

Arrowmaster wrote: post #166
toofy wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

while i agree that unifi is worth looking at, id urge anyone reading this to be a little weery there: i used to own extensive unifi equipment for my home network, 8 access points, 2 switches, gateway, a couple cams, etc… it was amazing, the initial setup, the interoperability, the stability and maintenance was absolutely painless. i will loudly sing them praises for those things, but i started noticing them trying to…

I did a full security system replacement for my previous employer in our data center. Replaced all the old IP cameras that connected directly to a small black box nvr with UniFi camera recording onto a UniFi Video server writing to a NAS cable locked to the rack in our locked data center. Two months later UniFi Video was discontinued and stopped receiving updates or support. If we wanted a supported platform we had t…

Guh.

This makes me wonder if it's inevitable for every hardware/software provider to be tempted by the candy now. Makes me ask myself if I could even resist it if I had a customer base with sunk costs who I could take advantage of. My feeling is that I could resist it, on principle, but most people wouldn't. And this is leaving out pressure from investors.

So such a company selling these solutions as locally run widgets - which we understand are under not just pressure to increase revenue, but also relentless pressure from governments to share their data - would definitely need to be completely self-funded, immediately profitable, and the solutions they sold would have to be permanent and not susceptible to any external market or government forces.

Zero updates and zero tracking of installations would be the goal.

[edit] but this is also not that hard. All the company needs to provide is a piece of software that stitches together existing hardware. The only updates would be when hardware updates, and those would be included in the price. If "NEVER CLOUD" was the company's entire corporate identity, then preserving that ethos would be a mandate.

[edit2] nevercloud.com is currently on sale for $8350. I'd suggest building the prime directive into the name, but that much money has better uses.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#174

Post by croes »

bandrami wrote: post #148

I still don't understand how otherwise sensible people can have an Alexa or Google Home. Like what part of that seems like a good idea to them?

Convenience.

Same with AI, the same people who fought against Google and Microsoft‘s data collecting now throw everything on data but the kitchen sink at their AI services.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#175

Post by harrall »

hackable_sand wrote: post #172
ncallaway wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. That's...not unusual. I would strongly to advise you to assume companies are extremely willing to lie in press releases.

Right, but we have to call it out every time.

What? This is basic human social skills.

It’s like when you don’t like someone’s friends but you’re not actually going to say that out loud. Instead you say “I'm just too tired to go out” — it’s a “diplomatic out.” Yes it’s a lie at face value but you leave people with their dignity while simultaneously signal your intent. Your friend, who presumably has social skills, picks up the subtext and you successfully communicate two layers of meaning with one sentence.

Press releases are the same thing.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#176

Post by tokioyoyo »

bandrami wrote: post #148

I still don't understand how otherwise sensible people can have an Alexa or Google Home. Like what part of that seems like a good idea to them?

Ability to “Hey Google, play Spotify” in every room and shower is pretty great. That’s literally the only reason I’ve been using it for 5+ years. Oh, and it was practically free.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#178

Post by BrenBarn »

dabinat wrote: post #85

> Following a comprehensive review, we determined the planned Flock Safety integration would require significantly more time and resources than anticipated. That doesn’t sound like “we’re cancelling this because our customers let us know loud and clear that they were ethically against this”. If the only thing keeping them from doing this is time and money, what guarantee do we have that they won’t do it again if time…

We would never have any guarantee of that no matter what they said.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#179

Post by petepete »

toofy wrote: post #135
Cerium wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not really cheap, nor best "value for the dollar", but I am extremely satisfied with UniFi [0]. Nearly instant setup, decent mobile apps, web interface, basically just works as you need. [0] https://ui.com/ Edit, update link.

while i agree that unifi is worth looking at, id urge anyone reading this to be a little weery there: i used to own extensive unifi equipment for my home network, 8 access points, 2 switches, gateway, a couple cams, etc… it was amazing, the initial setup, the interoperability, the stability and maintenance was absolutely painless. i will loudly sing them praises for those things, but i started noticing them trying to…

Were you using Unifi VOIP or the enterprise Identity stuff?

They're the only subscription things I've seen if you have your own controller.

I haven't seen that writing on the wall yet, Unifi are one of a select few tech companies I trust.

Re: Ring cancels its partnership with Flock Safety after surveillance backlash

#180

Post by dylan604 »

noduerme wrote: post #161
crote wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn't an inherently unsolvable problem. Peer-to-peer file sharing and video calls have been able to work around it for ages . The same approach could be used for cameras - see for example Home Assistant's remote access. Sure, you'd still need a cloud-based STUN-like discovery service, but a small one-time fee should easily cover operating it.

Right..Or instead of STUN/TURN just use Tailscale for now. I think the reason no one's packaged this into a slick Ring-like plug-and-play probably comes down to corporate greed and how hard it is to raise money if your intention is to start a business that doesn't have ever-expanding verticals. Like, this is a set of solved problems. They just need to be smoothed and packed for the user.

You seem pretty sure of yourself. So when will you be releasing this product that you claim is such low hanging fruit? Right, now you know why this product doesn't exist.
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