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Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

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171–180 of 192 posts

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#171

"ProtonDB tracks compatibility, and counts 7000+ games that are verified to work as well or almost as well as on Windows" - I always laugh when a media outlet uses ProtonDB as an example as the reality is something different. I have a ~1500 games big Steam Library and I'm also a Linux User for 20+ years - yes, I do use Windows only for gaming and on my work pc. When I fire up my linux workstation or steam deck and br…

> as nostalgia hit hard

in my experience the older games are more of a pain to get running, as a lot more tweaks are needed

it's the case on Windows too, but on Linux there's an additional need to mess with DLL overrides DXVK settings and the like

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#172
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Steam you download from steampowered.com can be an open platform at the same time that the Steam that comes preinstalled on the Steam Machine is a closed platform. Seems unlikely because we believe Valve has integrity. But it's possible they have less integrity than we think, and they pursue this strategy to make some of those games with kernel-level anti-cheat available on the Steam Machine.

> Steam you download from steampowered.com can be an open platform at the same time that the Steam that comes preinstalled on the Steam Machine is a closed platform. i dont think that's possible unless steam choose to go the route of what apple does with iOS and macOS - both essentially are "different" OS's. But if that's the case, then games would have to be written "twice" (or have engine support directly from engi…

Windows has locked down variants. Nobody has to recompile apps to use those.

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#173

>that this is actually Steam Machine 2.0. Valve already tried this a decade ago, and it flopped. I find this framing to be beyond maddening. Sure, it wasn't an iPod, and if you measure it against that kind of expectation, of course it's a flop, because it wasn't an overnight success. But I think it's more appropriately understood as a soft launch of an ecosystem, to strategically rebalance Valve away from the potenti…

> I find this framing to be beyond maddening.

Yeah, it's like the people who say, oh, the iPhone mini was a flop. That was a BILLION DOLLAR product. How many companies would LOVE to have a billion dollar product???

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#174

> with current-gen consoles (which are sold at a loss, and so would be expected to be cheaper) This is not true. It was true in 2019 when the PS5 was initially announced, but PS5 has been sold at a (slim) profit since 2021. Xbox probably sold at a loss for longer, but it definitely isn't sold at a loss in 2025. The Switch & Switch 2 have always been profitable. The BOM cost of the Steam Machine has been estimated at…

Hi, thanks for pointing this out! Two questions: 1. Do you think that inaccuracy undercuts the point? If so, I'll correct the article; if not, I'll include it as a note in my planned follow-up. 2. Do you have the link(s) handy for those figures? If not, I can try to find them myself, but I figured it would be easier to ask first.

If you Google you'll find links of varying quality. Direct statements from Sony, but Nintendo and Microsoft not so much. It's all third party analysis which I find compelling.

Does your analysis still hold if the Steam Box base model sells for $600? Analysts estimated the BOM at $425 - $450. Add a little bit for RAM inflation, and Valve can still sell for $600 and technically be selling without subsidies as promised. They also promised to price it "like a PC". Lots of PC's sell for $300, so that also doesn't really constrain them.

I don't think your analysis depends on the Steam Box selling for higher than $600, but you're a better judge of that than I am.

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#176
IMO Apple and Valve are taking the opposite approaches but on a different axis than the article discusses: Apple is continuing to increase their lock in and remove choice, while Valve continues to add choice. You can argue that Steam being a nigh-monopoly means there isn't a lot of choice, but I'd argue that's not correct. For one, Steam rarely censors games (it does happen! A notable case happened this month! But it happens rarely) and doesn't have requirements for games to use Steam's platform technology to be on the market. In fact, you're allowed to offer direct competitors to Steam features in your game without penalty (some games I play have both Steam Workshop support and the game dev's own mod platform support). For another Steam doesn't try to nudge you towards their solutions constantly either (eg like in the recent article on passkeys where the user had to click half a dozen times to not use Touch ID with the Touch ID option being on every page of those clicks). And of course, there's the "Add a non-Steam game or app" button in Steam that just asks you "where's the executable" and then it gets all the non-platform features Steam offers, like the overlay, screenshots, Steam Input (I think it even supports community input profiles for non-Steam games; I'm pretty sure I've seen community profiles for Primehack on my Steam Deck), etc. Of course the Steam Deck (and now Steam Machine and Steam Frame) are constantly advertised as "it's just a PC and you can do whatever you want with it". There's no lock in; you can install competitors' stores on those devices easily.

The reverse playbook then is that Apple is trying to make every option other than staying in the Apple ecosystem a bad choice, while Valve is trying to make Steam the best option in every scenario. The difference in base philosophy is the important part.

(Of course as a profit-seeking corporation there's no guarantee they'll stay this way, particularly after gaben leaves, but I'll appreciate it while it's here at least.)

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#177
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm all for MS bashing and laughing at their incompetence, but was there really any threat there? I don't know anyone on PC who was interested in buying a game anywhere other than Steam in 2015.

It was specifically the release of Windows RT (Windows 8 on ARM) in 2012 that had people nervous that Microsoft wanted to lock Windows down long-term in the manner of iOS and Apple. Windows RT only ran code signed by Microsoft and only installed programs from Microsoft's store. It failed, and Microsoft let off the gas locking down Windows, but that moment was probably the specific impetus for Gabe Newell to set Valve…

This was also closely related to their initial plans with the Xbox One to essentially kill used games, which they were about a decade to fast on rolling out.

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#178
post #157
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm all for MS bashing and laughing at their incompetence, but was there really any threat there? I don't know anyone on PC who was interested in buying a game anywhere other than Steam in 2015.

I never installed Steam, nor I intend to.

How many games have you bought in 2015?

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#179
post #39

"ProtonDB tracks compatibility, and counts 7000+ games that are verified to work as well or almost as well as on Windows" - I always laugh when a media outlet uses ProtonDB as an example as the reality is something different. I have a ~1500 games big Steam Library and I'm also a Linux User for 20+ years - yes, I do use Windows only for gaming and on my work pc. When I fire up my linux workstation or steam deck and br…

gamer!==gamer. These are your own choices. For me Assetto Corsa + other racing games + CS2 work perfectly. And with sway/i3, unlike in Windows, I can throw the game around in whichever way I wish. No laggy alt-tab or random crashes that my Windows user friends often have.

Simracing is the only reason my gaming rig runs windows. I never even thought my hardware would work on linux (especially my motion hardware). And stuff like crewchief and race telemetry. How do you deal with all that on linux?

Re: Valve is running Apple's playbook in reverse

#180
post #178
post #157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never installed Steam, nor I intend to.

How many games have you bought in 2015?

Enough, on physical computer stores selling those little shiny things called DVDs.

As for how many, that was 10 years ago, I hardly can remember everything I ate last week.

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