Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
171–180 of 205 posts
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
Googling around a bit, Sublime Text doesn't seem to be particularly good at this: https://forum.sublimetext.com/t/unable-to-open-a-large-text-... In my experience, BBEdit will open files that kill other editors: "Handling large files presents no intrinsic problems for BBEdit, though some specific operations may be limited when dealing with files over 2GB in size."
Sublime text works better on large files (where file sizes are a few gb) compared to VSCode. But, you can go faster depending on your usecase: - If you're trying to manually look through the file, use `less`. You can scroll up and down, go quickly to the top and bottom of the file, and also search the file for strings quickly - If you already know the string in the file that you're looking for, use ripgrep - If you'r…
In fact, I believe that is what vscode uses.
Apparently there’s been a neglected issue about bringing it to Zed. https://github.com/zed-industries/zed/issues/4560
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#173Zed was supposed to be the answer to Atom / Sublime Text in my opinion, and I kinda do want to use it as my main driver, but it just isn’t there yet for me. It’s shameful because I like its aesthetics as a product more than the competition out there. Just this other day I tried using it for something it sort of advertised itself as the superior thing, which was to load this giant text file I had instantly and let me…
Thoughts on https://nova.app/ ?
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
10 bucks on copilot and you get unlimited + unlimited gpt4.1 etc Copilot is the best value by far
How well does copilot edit prediction work vs Zed’s?
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think there's still space in the editor market for an open-source Sublime/Zed alternative. I've been working solo on a code editor with similar characteristics for a few years. It's still a work in progress, but it's already feature-rich (all the basics and some advanced features, like LSP, DAP, multi-cursor, etc.): https://github.com/SpartanJ/ecode/ ecode can handle big files, though it's not specifically designed…
Why? Genuine curiosity, what's the angle for a market for sublime/zed alternatives? What are they lacking? And congrats on your project, looks interesting.
In my opinion, Sublime’s biggest gap is that it’s not open-source, and there aren’t many (if any) open-source alternatives that match its feature set, performance, and unique user experience, Sublime just feels especially nice. Zed comes closest, and I think it’s fantastic, but it’s VC-backed, so their focus on profitability will likely shape the user experience over time (as some users are already noticing). Every editor has its pros and cons, and preferences vary, but there’s always room for innovation. Even subtle differences can add up to a significantly better user experience. With ecode, I’m aiming to deliver a polished, enjoyable experience while subtly innovating on common editor features. That said, ecode is opinionated in some ways, so it won’t suit everyone, though it’s highly customizable and configurable.
> And congrats on your project, looks interesting.
Thanks! =)
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#176Earlier quoted context omitted.
I feel like Zed stopped working on the editor itself since AI was rolled out. I also wanted it to be the open-source alternative to Sublime, but nothing comes close.
I think their recent push to delegate to CLI agents in the agent panel is the right direction. Claude Code has been running in Zed for the past month. Sure, there are SDK limitations and kinks to iron out, but it’s moving quickly. I’m into it.
My complaints:
No Claude code hooks support at the time of this writing. As someone who leverages this somewhat heavily this is why I don’t really use it all the time. I actually find it to be somewhat of a feature at times because I can simply run the thing through Zed if I want to temporarily run with no hooks.
Performance is noticeably degraded presumably because of the “ACP” protocol they invented. I usually work either directly in Claude terminal window using its edit tools or using repoprompt’s mcp editor tools and both are noticeably faster than running in zed.
What seems to be memory leaks in the agent window causes sluggish performance, especially when scrolling. It’s not bad enough to make it unusable, but for an editor whose main advertisement is speed it feels particularly painful.
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#177Zed was supposed to be the answer to Atom / Sublime Text in my opinion, and I kinda do want to use it as my main driver, but it just isn’t there yet for me. It’s shameful because I like its aesthetics as a product more than the competition out there. Just this other day I tried using it for something it sort of advertised itself as the superior thing, which was to load this giant text file I had instantly and let me…
I feel like Zed stopped working on the editor itself since AI was rolled out. I also wanted it to be the open-source alternative to Sublime, but nothing comes close.
https://zed.dev/releases/stable
(And that's even with almost none of the work on the massive Windows project being included in the changelog!)
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course it’s more expensive. It’s still tokens, but considerably more of them.
That's the thing, I can't visualize (and I don't think most people can) what "tokens" represent for image or video outputs. For text I just assume them to be word stems or more like work-family-members (cat-feline-etc). For images and videos I guess each character, creature, idea in it is a token? Blue sky, cat walking around, gentleman with a top hat, multiplied by the number of frames?
For images, you take patches of the image (say 16x16 patches[1]), and then directly pass it into the FFN+transformer machinery[2]. As such, there is no vocabulary of tokens for images[3]. So, the billing happens per image patch. i.e, for large images, your cost will go up[2] Since it will have more px*py patches.
[1] x 3, due to RGB
[2] Upto a point, it gets downsamples to lower quality beyond a certain res. The downsampling happens in many ways... Qwen-VL uses a CNN, GPT iirc stuffs a downsampler after the embedding layer... As well as before. Anyways, they usually just take some average reduction by that downsampler and cut your billed tokens by that much in all these cases. OpenAIs bin-based billing is like this.
[3] Dall-E from way back when did have a discrete set of tokens and it mapped all patches of all images in the world to one from that, IIRC.
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#179Earlier quoted context omitted.
There have been improvements recently, but it still has some of the worst text rendering of any editor on macOS, if you have a non-4K display plugged in. Rendering text is kind of a big deal!
It's not just on Mac. Zed's font rendering on Linux is also buggy and ugly. And they don't seem to care much: https://github.com/zed-industries/zed/issues/11676 https://github.com/zed-industries/zed/issues/7992 https://github.com/zed-industries/zed/issues/4334 Font rendering should be the most important feature of a text editor.
A downside that comes with the territory of building the rendering pipeline from scratch is needing to work through the long tail of complex and tradeoff-heavy font rendering issues on different displays, operating systems, drivers, etc.
I know it's taking awhile to get through, but I agree it's important!
Re: Zed's Pricing Has Changed: LLM Usage Is Now Token-Based
#180This whole business model of trying to shave off or arbitrage a fraction of the money going to OpenAI and Anthropic just sucks. And it seems precarious. There's no honest way to resell tokens at a profit, and everyone knows it.
The whole business model even for OAI/Anthropic is unsustainable.. they are already running it at a huge loss atm, and will do for the foreseeable future. The economics simply doesn't work, unfortunately or not
AI, just like cloud was before this, is being treated as "infrastructure". The reason people invest in roads is not to make money from the road itself, but rather recuper all the losses from the new extremely profitable businesses that will come on top of this infrastructure. To the stock ticker, this looks like a boom+bust cycle. But really, it's a bust+boom cycle as far as the investors are concerned. Saudi Arabia don't give a hoot about transformers, but they know if they invest their large amounts of capital in the new infrastructure - huge models in expensive datacenters using cities worth of power, they can invest in the many new hyper profitable businesses on top. Also helps that it locks in demand for oil, I guess :P
A similar example for cloud would be the gajillion cloud SaaS, DevOps, cloud security whatever businesses that only exist today because the whole cloud infra segment ran unprofitable for a long time and created the infrastructure for all this.
These new businesses will not be multi hundred-billion dollar businesses, no. They will all be million dollar businesses. But you'll have a million such businesses. Everyone that's stuffing money into AI today is hoping that there will be a huge product layer [1] on top of this new infrastructure once it's all consolidated at a few major players allowing "infra" costs to drop considerably, which they can milk.
The stock of all these companies going high is just wall st making it easy for people to buy debt from this infrastructure. If they're indisciplined, they will co-mingle this debt with normal people's daily lives debt and sell it as one, and everything gets affected badly. If they're not, then the stock market will complain, but normal folks will be kind of OK.
[1] well, everyone has this same idea, meaning there also a lot of short term investors trying to make gains while openai/nvidia/etc are on their way up, sort of like greater fool investing, but let's ignore them for the purposes of this argument.
[Note] of course, whether cloud/ai/whatever are actually useful infra that deserves to be force-created is up for debate.. many disagree, not me though.