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A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

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Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

be a bad citizen and just set it to 1000 packets... There isn't really any downside apart from potentially clogging up someone who has a dialup connection and bufferbloat.

This sounds like a terrible idea, but can anybody pinpoint why exactly?

Doing that would basically disable the congestion control at the start of the connection.

Which would be kinda annoying on a slow connection.

Either you'd have buffer issues or dropped packets.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

be a bad citizen and just set it to 1000 packets... There isn't really any downside apart from potentially clogging up someone who has a dialup connection and bufferbloat.

This sounds like a terrible idea, but can anybody pinpoint why exactly?

Anything non-standard will kill shitty middleboxes so I assume spamming packets faster than anticipated will have corporate networks block you off as a security thread of some kind. Mobile carriers also do some weird proxying hacks to "save bandwidth", especially on But in practice, I think this should work most of the time for most people. On slower connections, your connection will probably crawl to a halt due to retransmission hell, though. Unless you fill up the buffers on the ISP routers, making every other connection for that visitor slow down or get dropped, too.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#173
post #95
post #74

I just checked my home page [1] and it has a compressed transfer size of 7.0 kB. / 2.7 kB main.css 2.5 kB favicon.png 1.8 kB ------------------- Total 7.0 kB Not bad, I think! I generate the blog listing on the home page (as well as the rest of my website) with my own static site generator, written in Common Lisp [2]. On a limited number of mathematical posts [3], I use KaTeX with client-side rendering. On such pages…

> That said, I do use KaTeX with client-side rendering on a limited number of pages that have mathematical content You could try replacing KaTeX with MathML: https://w3c.github.io/mathml-core/

> You could try replacing KaTeX with MathML: https://w3c.github.io/mathml-core/

I would love to use MathML, not directly, but automatically generated from LaTeX, since I find LaTeX much easier to work with than MathML. I mean, while I am writing a mathematical post, I'd much rather write LaTeX (which is almost muscle memory for me), than write MathML (which often tends to get deeply nested and tedious to write). However, the last time I checked, the rendering quality of MathML was quite uneven across browsers, both in terms of aesthetics as well as in terms of accuracy.

For example, if you check the default demo at https://mk12.github.io/web-math-demo/ you'd notice that the contour integral sign has a much larger circle in the MathML rendering (with most default browser fonts) which is quite inconsistent with how contour integrals actually appear in print.

Even if I decide to fix the above problem by loading custom web fonts, there are numerous other edge cases (spacing within subscripts, sizing within subscripts within subscripts, etc.) that need fixing in MathML. At that point, I might as well use full KaTeX. A viable alternative is to have KaTeX or MathJaX generate the HTML and CSS on server-side and send that to the client and that's what I meant by server-side rendering in my earlier comment.

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#174

I agree with the sentiment here, the thing is, I've noticed that the newer generations are using frameworks like Next.js as default for building simple static websites. That's their bare bone start. The era of plain html + css (and maybe a sprinkle of js) feels like it's fading away, sadly.

You have noticed that only just recently? This has been the case since jQuery became popular before 2010.

Arguably it's been this way since web 2.0 became a thing in like 2008?

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#177
post #7

The overlap of people that don’t know what TCP Slow Start is and those that should care about their website loading a few milliseconds faster is incredibly small. A startup should focus on, well, starting up, not performance; a corporation large enough to optimise speed on that level will have a team of experienced SREs that know over which detail to obsess.

When your approach is "I don't care because I have more important things to focus on", you never care. There's always something you can do that's more important to a company than optimising the page load to align with the TCP window size used to access your server. This is why almost all applications and websites are slow and terrible these days.

That and SPA

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#178
post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. It's exactly why Microsoft use modern frameworks such as React Native for their Start Menu used by billions of people every day.

Wait… please please tell me this is a weirdly specific joke

Only certain live portions of it, and calling it React is a stretch but not entirely wrong:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44124688#:~:text=Just%2...

the notion was popularized as an explanation for a CPU core spiking whenever the start menu opens on Win11

Re: A 14kb page can load much faster than a 15kb page (2022)

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This idea that performance is irrelevant gets under my skin. It's how we ended up with Docker and Kubernetes and the absolute slop stack that is destroying everything it touches. Performance matters. We've spent so many decades misinterpreting Knuth's quote about optimization that we've managed to chew up 5-6 orders of magnitude in hardware performance gains and still deliver slow, bloated and defective software prod…

Containers were invented because VMs were too slow to cold start and used too much memory. Their whole raison d'être is performance.

Yeah, I think Electron would be the poster child
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