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Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

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Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#171

Post by peterbecich »

LarsDu88 wrote: post #67
perihelions wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't sound technically plausible to me—there aren't any inexpensive tests. Do you mean something like this 3M product[0], that's intended for paint not food, and is documented as "LeadCheck™ Swabs reliabily detect lead in paints at 0.5% (5,000 ppm). 3M™ LeadCheck™ Swabs may indicate lead in some paint films as low as 0.06% (600ppm)." ? If so, those aren't remotely suited for this purpose—those detection lower…

Thanks for this heads up. This will be useful information for other people with the same idea I had.

A lab such as https://aihlabs.com/ may be able to test food

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#172

Post by rahimnathwani »

in_cahoots wrote: post #125
maxerickson wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh, the culprit isn't turmeric, it's lead chromate that farmers were putting on turmeric. For most readers of English, it is not an expected fact that someone would be intentionally adding lead to food. In the article, the turmeric related lead poisonings were due to turmeric bought at Bangladeshi markets, not processed, packaged spices bought from a grocer.

But for anyone who knows the Bangladeshi community this isn't a surprise at all. Neither the source nor the way it wakes its way into immigrants diets. Every time my Bengali friends visit Bangladesh they take an empty suitcase to fill with spices, sweets, and the like. The adulteration has been going on for decades. I feel like the article should have been written from that perspective- an outsider discovering how a…

Eh? Adulteration has been going on for decades, yet your friends deliberately pack light so they can bring back those contaminated spices?

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#173

Post by in_cahoots »

rahimnathwani wrote: post #172
in_cahoots wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But for anyone who knows the Bangladeshi community this isn't a surprise at all. Neither the source nor the way it wakes its way into immigrants diets. Every time my Bengali friends visit Bangladesh they take an empty suitcase to fill with spices, sweets, and the like. The adulteration has been going on for decades. I feel like the article should have been written from that perspective- an outsider discovering how a…

Eh? Adulteration has been going on for decades, yet your friends deliberately pack light so they can bring back those contaminated spices?

Cognitive dissonance is a thing, yes. Would you also be surprised to know that some Americans smoke and don't use seatbelts?

Not every immigrant is a twenty something working on a Masters degree or working in the tech industry. Most of the Bengalis I know, especially in the NYC area, are here by sheer luck and determination moreso than formal education. The older ones have survived famine, cyclones, and literal genocide. At that point, trying to convince someone that their favorite spices or sweets that they grew up with for 40+ years may be harmful is pretty difficult.

If anything, getting to know the immigrant community has been enlightening in pointing out my own biases. It's easy to point the finger at someone else because they're a fish out of water. But put me in a different culture (or really just let time pass with the attendant changes in culture and technology) and the same thing would be true for me.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#174

Post by tim333 »

khelavastr wrote: post #168

Lack of firearms regulations stops public action against lead poisoners. In South America, where street gangs are far more common, you don't see rampant lead pollution the same way. Nobody dumps lead in narco territories because order of law is so much better enforced than relatively lawless democratic countries like Bangladesh.

Meh - we don't have much lead in Sainsburys in the UK in spite of having quite strict gun control. I don't think street gangs are the answer to improving health and safety.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#176

Post by wtcactus »

abeppu wrote: post #93
phendrenad2 wrote: post #57

I think this NPR article is too quick to put a positive spin on this. They have made a nice little story here with a happy ending. Farmers had blackened turmeric -> they used a random yellow die they found -> massive lead spike in everyone's bloodstream -> Americans came in with a xray gun and saved the day -> no more lead in the blood. But if you ascribe even the slightest but of agency to any of the non-Americans i…

> But if you ascribe even the slightest but of agency to any of the non-Americans involved, you have to wonder if this problem will come back. From the article: > And recently they are celebrating some big news on the lead fighting front: This week, UNICEF and the United States Agency for International Development (USAID) announced a new $150 million initiative to combat lead poisoning. Americans have disassembled US…

What about holding the people that do the crime accountable instead of the ones being continuously extorted into giving their money so that someone else doesn’t do something stupid and/or criminal?

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#177

Post by wtcactus »

mathgradthrow wrote: post #144
phendrenad2 wrote: post #57

I think this NPR article is too quick to put a positive spin on this. They have made a nice little story here with a happy ending. Farmers had blackened turmeric -> they used a random yellow die they found -> massive lead spike in everyone's bloodstream -> Americans came in with a xray gun and saved the day -> no more lead in the blood. But if you ascribe even the slightest but of agency to any of the non-Americans i…

in the article it asserts that the farmers didn't know the effects of lead chromate on human health, they were just "expanding their business". I guess since it's just fraud and negligence, we should forgive it?

Well, it’s more about the origin of the farmers than anything else. If they where American or European farmers, you can be sure NPR would mark them as the villains of this story.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#178

Post by fuzzfactor »

kragen wrote: post #160
fuzzfactor wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>as much as 1000 ppm or even higher. The higher it is, the less likely for challenges in detection, and/or interference from background. >lead concentrations as high as 483 ppm SSDD. Shouldn't be that hard to detect at that level which is way above ppb. There are a number of reliable methods. However if the Minimum Detectable Level for a particular test procedure was only 500 ppm or above, one of these samples would…

I agree that hand-held XRF guns should be able to detect such lead levels, and I believe that was in fact what the police used when they did the publicity stunt in the Bangladesh market. At any rate, it sounds like you know a lot more about the question than I do. I was only disputing pfdietz's comment, "The concentrations of lead being discussed here are as much as 1000 ppm or even higher."

Good call because results should be expectd to be all over the ball park, and I think even higher numbers could be found. But no amount of lead is supposed to be acceptable.

>sounds like you know a lot more about the question

SSDD says it all without explanation, but here's a little.

Until you've spent lots of time at the bench, it's not easy to understand why a 1000 and a 483 might just be the same sample tested in different labs.

Or even the same lab on different days.

If so that would look even more embarrassing when my arbitrary reporting convention But it's actually not unheard of to get a positive and a negative on the same sample even with some of the most sophisticated equipment

Explaining the rest of the story could fill textbooks, but the operators wouldn't be reading them anyway :\

So that's the most important thing to know, besides the actual spectrums which are table stakes.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#179

Post by fuzzfactor »

throwawaymaths wrote: post #152

this week, same pigment: https://www.cnn.com/2025/07/09/china/china-lead-poisoning-ti...

Not the same exact yellow lead compound, I suspect red lead oxide instead.

I've been suspicious of red lead oxide in paprika for a while now too.

Some paprika just seems so much brighter colored than ever to me.

Re: Lead pigment in turmeric is the culprit in a global poisoning mystery (2024)

#180

Post by oliwarner »

ericmay wrote: post #124
abeppu wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But if you ascribe even the slightest but of agency to any of the non-Americans involved, you have to wonder if this problem will come back. From the article: > And recently they are celebrating some big news on the lead fighting front: This week, UNICEF and the United States Agency for International Development (USAID) announced a new $150 million initiative to combat lead poisoning. Americans have disassembled US…

> The agency of Americans is also contributing to this reccuring. I’m going to push back very, very hard on ascribing any sort of blame on anyone other than those who are committing these acts. Least of all the American taxpayer, regardless of whether or not dismantling USAID is a good idea. If the rest of the world is so helpless that all hope depends on Americans to solve even problems such as this and it’s our fau…

If a major consumer of a product decides it doesn't care to inspect and regulate an import, the global supply for it gets tainted. You're so busy cutting red tape, you lower the standards everywhere.

I do absolutely agree, it's not your fault that cheaper, dirtier, methods of production are being used, but your lack of standards is a major contributing factor.

This is the reason the EU and UK exclude so much US produce. To allow it would lower local standards too.

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