Earlier quoted context omitted.
Every weapon ever devised by humankind has been used
I must have missed the time we used tungsten telephone poles and cobalt bombs?
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Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
171–180 of 186 posts
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
We always have moved forward technologically despite doomers. They were there for first person shooter games, the Internet in general, dating apps, etc. That’s not to say those things didn’t have significant downsides. They do. But it took years to get there and they weren’t an overnight surprise, like they seem to be in the Black Mirror episodes I saw. Imagine what a few Black Mirror episodes would look like if they…
Part of moving forward is that we've avoided nuclear war so far, but we certainly built the arsenals to stop all forward progress.
There have been enough declassified "close call" stories that I don't think "we haven't had nuclear war yet" doesn't carry much water for me. Kind of like "I have never died", which is technically true but I have lots of info that makes me think extrapolating my past doesn't mean I'll never die in the future.
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Imagine some theoretical technological advancement. Now take it out of context, put it in the worst possible circumstances, and imagine it appeared into a society like ours without any prior thought or discussion about the possible downsides of that technology This is precisely why I love Black Mirror. Despite the warnings, we're allowing companies to build killer robot and are running a large scale experiment to b…
> Despite the warnings, we're allowing companies to build killer robot and are running a large scale experiment to build a god. I am doing everything I can think of to stop AI companies from building a god (to borrow your words). Last year and this year I've donated five figures to nonprofits that are trying to slow down AI development. I write letters to legislators whenever the opportunity arises — I wrote a letter…
I like that you are trying to influence the world into a shape you think is better and more just.
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
> […] and imagine it appeared into a society like ours without any prior thought or discussion about the possible downsides of that technology." Which is basically how most technologies appear{s,ed} in society: without prior thought / discussion. There's certainly a lot of talk while it's being rolled out , but rarely prior . > For example: in a society where autonomous security guard robots kill intruders, there wou…
> Which is basically how most technologies appear{s,ed} in society: without prior thought / discussion. > There's certainly a lot of talk while it's being rolled out, but rarely prior. This is a semantic argument about timing. One could argue the Internet is still "being rolled out" today, but it's certainly widely available and we've had decades to reflect on its impact on society. It's not like the Internet was sud…
I think context matters as well. In your final example of death for shoplifting we would have less shoplifting, all other things being equal. We might also have other unexpected consequences like more embezzlement or more knock offs or more people selling things that "fell off the truck".
Additionally, even if I know you'll kill me if you catch me, I'll still try to steal food if my family is starving and there is no way for me to earn it.
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#175Earlier quoted context omitted.
For example: in a society where autonomous security guard robots kill intruders, there would not be people sneaking into warehouses. We have a society (in the US) where cops often shoot first and ask questions later, but many people still do crimes. People will take risks about things that desperately matter to them, and indeed stories of such risk-taking are common cultural fodder. Are you not just generalizing from…
No. You are just generalizing from specific news stories you've read about cops.
I am not (see below) and in any case this is not relevant to the question posed to GP, which was why s/he thinks people would abstain from risky behavior just because risks exist.
https://www.annualreviews.org/content/journals/10.1146/annur...
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#176Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I dunno about you, but I don't care about a computer program that believes it's me living on after I die. 1% of your cells are replaced daily. Presumably you still believe you're you even though much of you is constantly being replaced. If it were an option would you really deny your future self an arbitrarily long happy life because you got hung up on Theseus's Paradox?
I don't remember the part of that scenario where a scan is taken of the ship and uploaded to a server. I long ago accepted that my image of self is a sort of illusion. That things I consider other, like microbes in my gut, constitute a large portion of me. And I change over time. Even the memories I have are copies of copies. But all that happens in a continuity. Being uploaded is a stark difference and a disconnect…
You lose consciousness for a few hours every night. If you've ever been put out for surgery the effect is even stronger. If someone could copy you when you were out, are you sure you'd have any idea it occurred? Could you prove you're not the copy? What if we're in that uploaded world now, would you be able to tell?
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#177Huh, i guess i both agree and disagree with this article. I disagree that black mirror has to save the world. Art doesn't have to literally save the world to be useful, it just has to add to the conversation. The fact we are talking about it proves that it has. On the other hand, i've never really liked black mirror that much. It feels polemical to me. Its unrelenting pessimism robs it of nuance, which makes it feel…
The part I don't like about it is that the premise is too often: "Imagine some theoretical technological advancement. Now take it out of context, put it in the worst possible circumstances, and imagine it appeared into a society like ours without any prior thought or discussion about the possible downsides of that technology." For example: in a society where autonomous security guard robots kill intruders, there woul…
>"Imagine some theoretical technological advancement. Now take it out of context, put it in the worst possible circumstances, and imagine it appeared into a society like ours without any prior thought or discussion about the possible downsides of that technology."
So, exactly like the real world case with all modern tech advancements?
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Imagine some theoretical technological advancement. Now take it out of context, put it in the worst possible circumstances, and imagine it appeared into a society like ours without any prior thought or discussion about the possible downsides of that technology This is precisely why I love Black Mirror. Despite the warnings, we're allowing companies to build killer robot and are running a large scale experiment to b…
We always have moved forward technologically despite doomers. They were there for first person shooter games, the Internet in general, dating apps, etc. That’s not to say those things didn’t have significant downsides. They do. But it took years to get there and they weren’t an overnight surprise, like they seem to be in the Black Mirror episodes I saw. Imagine what a few Black Mirror episodes would look like if they…
>We always have moved forward technologically despite doomers. They were there for first person shooter games, the Internet in general, dating apps, etc.
You say as if they weren't right about those things, and they aren't the toxic to society crap they're today.
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#179How did we have shows like The Handmaid's Tale and 50.5% of America was like yeah that sounds good let's go for that? How did we have decades of superhero movies and then elect a bonafide fascist villain? I don’t know. The lessons we were teaching weren’t the right lessons somehow. Or they were swamped by social media nonsense and decades of underfunding education.
Don't forget all the people that thought Homelander was the good guy.
Re: Black Mirror's pessimism porn won't lead us to a better future
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
>we don't have a fictional vision of the future to use as a goal. yes we do, it's called The Culture by Iain M Banks. It's a series of books, and it's not easy-web-novels reading, so in the grand scheme of things is pretty niche
Yeah, The Culture, where the real powers are AI. Very niche, just as Yudkowski...
That's a long way off.
What's going to be interesting near term is when AI management outperforms human management. The dynamics of capitalism then demand that AI be in charge. Marshall Brain's "Manna" is the classic in this area.