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Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

nytimes.com

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Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#171

Post by Paradigma11 »

mnky9800n wrote: post #53
drumhead wrote: post #4

No Hyper-economy, like China or the EU is going to stand about and take what seems like economic intimidation from the US. All the unaffiliated nations are going to be collateral damage in this clash of the economic titans. The best thing everyone can do is maintain low tariffs and try and strike free trade deals with each other. But the consequeces of Trumps Trade war are going to be disasterous for smaller developi…

Why does America get inflation and everyone else gets deflation in your view?

Because China will flood the markets with its products that it can no longer economically sell in the US.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#172

Post by [deleted] »

ajross wrote: post #74
heisgone wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No doubt Lutnick and Bessent are taking crazy risks with their strategy. If they are to be believed, their plan is to have a recession at the begining of the term to get long term bond price lower and refinance the debt. By their own account, they outright said to Trump things aren't going to be good until 2028. So, I guess we have to prepare for a few years of crap. Let's hope it doesn't trigger a depression that wo…

FWIW, that is 100% a retconned explanation. No one anywhere was talking about this theory until the last week. It's clear that Trump demanded tariffs, tried to do it once early, and got cold feet. What happened with Lutnick et. al. is Court Politics. They saw an opening to improve their own status by selling a creative lie that would allow Trump to do what he wants. So he bought the lie and picked new favorites. But…

[deleted]

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#173

Post by rjtavares »

erelong wrote: post #130
rjtavares wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't be serious... It's like arguing against the expression "Putin's war in Ukraine" because Ukraine retaliated with drones.

Wikipedia calls it "China–United States trade war"... would this be thought to be inaccurate?

Wikipedia also calls Putin's war "Russo-Ukrainian War". I have no problem with either name. That's the point.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#174

Post by _DeadFred_ »

belter wrote: post #120
akmarinov wrote: post #5

Wonder whether Americans or the Chinese can weather tough times better. Chinese don’t get to protest or voice dissent and Americans can’t be bothered to

China makes everything, US does nothing. Who do you think will weather this better?

Small US companies near me, reliant on Chinese inputs, aren't suddenly getting hundreds of millions to build factories that'll take years to finish. Trump’s plan assumes most small businesses can pause everything for long, expensive factory construction/toolup projects. In my area our three big manufacturers depend on Canadian aluminum and Chinese subcomponents. Tariffs won’t bring jobs back but they’ll kill the ones we still have.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#175

Post by Aloisius »

bamboozled wrote: post #124
mraniki wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Navarro

specifically America’s chronic and ever-expanding trade deficit — says that America is the globe’s biggest trade loser and a victim of unfair, unbalanced, and nonreciprocal trade" Finally the source of “we’ve been treated unfairly” is revealed?

Eh. Not really. Trump has been espousing the same mercantilist zero-sum game view about trade since the 1980s.

He simply picked an economic advisor who shares his views.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#176

Post by _DeadFred_ »

s1artibartfast wrote: post #156
TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Half of Americans say they live paycheck to paycheck, so no - the majority of households will not be able to survive for long if they have to spend an extra few thousand to stay where they are today. Those that can will be cutting spending, which will ripple across the rest of the economy. There's no sign that negotiation is even possible, never mind likely. One tell is that tariffs have been applied to the Heard and…

>Half of Americans say they live paycheck to paycheck, so no - the majority of households will not be able to survive for long if they have to spend an extra few thousand to stay where they are today What do you think the death toll will be? A majority of households not surviving would put it over 160 million. $4k per capita (not household) loss would put the US in 2022 territory [1]. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/seri…

Holy bad faith bs from someone who pretends they're a straight shooter. “...the death toll.” What a trash response to Americans suffering.

So kind of you to volunteer that the poorest among us have nothing and should be happy about it.

You admit this is a $4k hit that Congress didn’t pass. Guess after all your talk here, you don’t actually believe in the Constitution or separation of powers just “I should be able to do what I want with power.”

$4k no biggie, right? From my experience, it just means when things wear out, they don’t get replaced. So shoes for kids get stretched to last longer. Car maintenance gets skipped. (You can judge a bad president by the number of broken-down cars on the side of the road.). It’s food not bought, medical/dental care skipped, rent coming up short.

The real death toll won’t be a one-time body count. It’ll be slow and quiet: worse health, more homelessness, more suicides. And for what? So we can LARP like we’re rebuilding American industry without giving businesses the capital, labor, or time to do it?

This isn’t strategy. It’s cruelty pretending to be policy.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#177

Post by _DeadFred_ »

sgc wrote: post #82
alephnerd wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the majority of households will not be able to survive for long if they have to spend an extra few thousand to stay where they are today. The median American household has an income of around $78,000 [0]. They can survive the blowback. The Trump admin on the other hand will not. As a Sullivan, Raimondo, and IRA supporting Dem, it's a win-win for me. Harsher policies against China have been enacted which will not be…

You do understand that means half of all American households make less than 78k? If your reasoning is based on the upper half of wealthiest Americans, it ignores virtually all the most vulnerable. Income distribution: https://www.statista.com/statistics/203183/percentage-distri...

They call it blowback because 'increased homelessness, suicides, kids not getting new shoes as they grow, people having teeth pulled instead of dental work' and 'you will have nothing and be happy' make their policy look bad.

Then later they will make fun of the people that have missing teeth because they chose food for their kids over dental work and call those people trash.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#178

Post by s1artibartfast »

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #176
s1artibartfast wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Half of Americans say they live paycheck to paycheck, so no - the majority of households will not be able to survive for long if they have to spend an extra few thousand to stay where they are today What do you think the death toll will be? A majority of households not surviving would put it over 160 million. $4k per capita (not household) loss would put the US in 2022 territory [1]. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/seri…

Holy bad faith bs from someone who pretends they're a straight shooter. “...the death toll.” What a trash response to Americans suffering. So kind of you to volunteer that the poorest among us have nothing and should be happy about it. You admit this is a $4k hit that Congress didn’t pass. Guess after all your talk here, you don’t actually believe in the Constitution or separation of powers just “I should be able to…

Im not the one making the hyperbolic claim that a majority of households wont survive long.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#179

Post by Aloisius »

belter wrote: post #120
akmarinov wrote: post #5

Wonder whether Americans or the Chinese can weather tough times better. Chinese don’t get to protest or voice dissent and Americans can’t be bothered to

China makes everything, US does nothing. Who do you think will weather this better?

Let's not be hyperbolic. The US is still the second largest manufacturer in the world.

Re: Trump's Trade War Escalates as China Retaliates with 34% Tariffs

#180

Post by _DeadFred_ »

heisgone wrote: post #150
ajross wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, that is 100% a retconned explanation. No one anywhere was talking about this theory until the last week. It's clear that Trump demanded tariffs, tried to do it once early, and got cold feet. What happened with Lutnick et. al. is Court Politics. They saw an opening to improve their own status by selling a creative lie that would allow Trump to do what he wants. So he bought the lie and picked new favorites. But…

$9 trillion of government debt is maturing over the next year. That's around 25% of the US debt. https://www.reuters.com/markets/us/us-treasury-plays-cat-mou...

'Trump talked about tariffs to Opra in the 80s because 25% of US debt would mature in 2025' isn't the 4d chess you think it is.
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