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Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

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Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#171

Post by jaybro867 »

trhway wrote: post #169
jfengel wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In 2016 they had tax breaks without spending cuts. And he's not actually saving all that much money. The employees are only a small part of the budget. He's doing it because hate for government employees has been a talking point since Reagan. He's getting huge accolades for sticking it to the evildoers. It's popular and fun.

that is the question - for example SpaceX needs FAA permits. With the federal employees severely cut in that future that Musk/Trump builds how that will be solved - 1. no FAA permits required or 2. SpaceX gets same-day service (or even total blanket exception) while everybody else waits 3 years?

[dead]

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#172

Post by majormajor »

koolba wrote: post #83
abirch wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In addition to these scientists, I heard from my friends in academia that they will be taking fewer PhD students because they're unsure of the funding. We may be looking at a lost decade.

[flagged]

When in the last forty years have Republicans shown any real interest in funding any new worthwhile research projects at the federal level? Versus just cutting what already exists?

The money being saved ain't for you.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#173

Post by bruce511 »

BLKNSLVR wrote: post #152
bruce511 wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bearing in mind that this administration won the election and a lot of what they are doing is more-or-less what they campaigned on, I'm not sure democracy is at risk. One can pick around the details, but for example with regard to the firings, voters clearly approved of the concept of smaller, cheaper government. Which is basically what's happening. This is essentially democracy in action. Yes, the voters may come to…

I mostly agree. Trump is behaving in a way that's consistent with his prior rhetoric. Where I disagree is that there may have been an expectation that the systems outside of "The President" would have stood up for themselves more, offered more resistance and slowed him down more. The slow-moving of government is (was though to be) it's own protection to some extent.

I'm not sure what evidence suggests that Republicans in congress would grow a spine to resist this. Conversely the evidence since 2016 suggests they actively applaud it.

The voters have voted out any congress people who resisted, sending a clear message that they want this path.

This may not be the pretty side of democracy, but it is democracy.

My point above (which I see is being downvoted) is not thst I see this as "good" , but rather that I see it as democratic. Everything going on is literally because the people voted for it. The stacking of the Supreme Court, the obstructionist behavior in congress, the tolerance for (Trump) crimes- this has all been rewarded, not penalized by voters.

If democracy is the will of the people , then what you see seeing is the power of that will.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#174

Post by arunabha »

There are obviously strong emotions on both sides regarding the actions of the first few weeks of the Trump administration. Whether you believe the goals are worthy or not, one must acknowledge that the manner in which all of this is being done is deeply disturbing.

Trump will be gone in a few years, one way or the other. However, the foundations that are being poured for legitimizing a strongman, authoritarian role for the executive and almost eliminating the role of the other two branches is deeply dangerous.

If you believe the goals are worthy enough that the ends justify the means, think of the worst president ever(in your opinion) and consider whether you'd want them to have the same power? Because politicians never let power go willingly. They will certainly point to Trump's precedent as a means of legitimizing their actions.

My fervent hope is that our institutions are strong enough to weather this assault and that enough people make it clear to the administration that there are lines they are not willing to cross. Whether that happens remains to be seen.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#175

Post by _heimdall »

polairscience wrote: post #28

This is true for many programs for reasons that will be hard to understand if you aren't a scientist. The NSF program managers are often pulled out of academia for brief periods of their career to do various tasks as experts. This means they are often probationary. This is the only way to hire people with deep expertise on the topic-du-jour. The trump administration fired in wide swaths many probationary employees at…

> Not evaluated efficiency cuts. Just thrashing about.

Personally I'm not sold on their tactics so far, but there is another way to view this than thrashing out.

Non-probationary federal employees are protected and not easily fired. If one honestly believes the government is bloated and so far into debt that the budget needs to be balanced at all costs, cutting anyone and anything you can may make sense.

Normally you wouldn't throw good food overboard, but if the ship is sinking you may have no choice other than to throw out anything that isn't bolted down.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#176

Post by majormajor »

Mathnerd314 wrote: post #126
Kindra wrote: post #32

Notwithstanding the other awful aspects of all of this, there’s a certain vibe of, “people who don’t understand how a system works attempting to act like they know how the system works and are too cowardly to admit they are breaking everything.” This just reads like “Character Limit” except replace Twitter with the federal government.

Sometimes the only way to know something is important is to shut it off and see if anyone complains. For example, lots of stories in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9629714 . Now certainly the Trump administration could have been more careful, but they only have 4 years so the Facebook motto of "move fast and break things" applies.

Have you been paying attention to Republicans over the last 40 years? They don't care if it's useful or important. They don't want government programs to exist.

Trump isn't changing that. Don't kid yourself.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#177

Post by greycol »

Mathnerd314 wrote: post #126
Kindra wrote: post #32

Notwithstanding the other awful aspects of all of this, there’s a certain vibe of, “people who don’t understand how a system works attempting to act like they know how the system works and are too cowardly to admit they are breaking everything.” This just reads like “Character Limit” except replace Twitter with the federal government.

Sometimes the only way to know something is important is to shut it off and see if anyone complains. For example, lots of stories in https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9629714 . Now certainly the Trump administration could have been more careful, but they only have 4 years so the Facebook motto of "move fast and break things" applies.

To be rather abrasive in my response: I believe your view is a waste of air. In case I'm correct how about we cut you off from air for a week and if there's a problem we'll restore it then.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#178

Post by daveguy »

warkdarrior wrote: post #97
sneak wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This violates consent, though. Consent matters, regardless of how much handwaving occurs after people choose to violate it. The other such places you describe also violate consent. Same criminal acts: coercion by violence. I do indeed believe in the things I have said, and I have indeed emigrated from the United States for many such reasons, principally among them my objection to being forced to fund neverending war.…

You can renounce your US citizenship and thus avoid the burden of US taxation.

Yes, please do this GP. Renounce your citizenship and be free of the big bad taxes. Most of us prefer infrastructure and long term public research.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#179

Post by amluto »

late2part wrote: post #114
thrfedsci022425 wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Federal scientist here. The situation is dire, and this is only the beginning. We've lost all employees with < 1 year of service, which has halted the new projects they were hired to work on. Leaders of 100 employee offices were booted since they had less than 1 year of federal service--back to another interim director. Those of us left are hamstrung since all travel has been canceled, and our credit cards will have…

[flagged]

Sensible oversight means you understand first and make changes second.

Re: Everyone at NSF overseeing the Platforms for Wireless Experimentation is gone

#180

Post by consumer451 »

_heimdall wrote: post #175
polairscience wrote: post #28

This is true for many programs for reasons that will be hard to understand if you aren't a scientist. The NSF program managers are often pulled out of academia for brief periods of their career to do various tasks as experts. This means they are often probationary. This is the only way to hire people with deep expertise on the topic-du-jour. The trump administration fired in wide swaths many probationary employees at…

> Not evaluated efficiency cuts. Just thrashing about. Personally I'm not sold on their tactics so far, but there is another way to view this than thrashing out. Non-probationary federal employees are protected and not easily fired. If one honestly believes the government is bloated and so far into debt that the budget needs to be balanced at all costs, cutting anyone and anything you can may make sense. Normally you…

Where exactly is the proof that the ship of government funded science in the USA was sinking?

If you don't mean just US funded science, then what evidence is there that the USA was sinking in general? When I look at the graph of debt increase, it was actually decreasing.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/1366899/percent-change-n...

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