171–180 of 201 posts
I'm sympathetic to the points being made but the argument that Oracle does not have its own JavaScript runtime does not hold. An OracleBD is able to execute triggers written in JavaScript since quite some time. see https://blogs.oracle.com/java/post/multilingual-engine-execu...
This response is just saying that "no we didn't fraudulently submit the node.js site, it's just (hand-waving)". They also state that they expect to win on the generic-ness aspect of the suit at trial with the relevant audience (hah). Most likely we'll see Oracle send out C&Ds to uses of Javascript without the (tm) Oracle for a few months before a trial starts. Whether that will be enough to convince a judge and/or ju…
Man, they ought to lose Java on generic-ness, let alone JavaScript. Java was invented by Sun and literally nobody cares (nor is particularly happy) that Oracle currently makes a version of the JDK. JavaScript is made by almost everyone in tech except Oracle. If the courts don’t strike down this trademark it’ll be nothing but blatant corporatism.
This is honestly an insanity level take. Oracle is the main contributor to OpenJdk. OpenJdk is the most widely used implementation of Java and Java is in the top 3 most used programming languages in the world. Thousands of developers and companies make their livelihoods off of Oracle and OpenJdk.
Oracle has been a better steward of Java than Sun ever was. Sun let Java languish as they did not have the money to keep developing it and to keep it relevant. Without Oracle Java would have never gotten past version 6 and let’s not forget Oracle was the one to completely open source OpenJdk under the GPL.
They didn't really enforce the trademark.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
Wasn’t LiveScript JS’s original name?
According to Wikipedia, it was a server-side language, that NetScape adapted to client-side and renamed JavaScript a few days before go-live, to piggyback on Java's name and please Sun Microsystem shareholders. Then people created node.js and went back to server-side JS. Life is cyclical.
JS was originally named Mocha, but it was renamed to LiveScript as a tie-in with the server tech. However, after the deal with Sun Microsystems to put Java in the browser, it was almost scrapped before being saved by giving it the final name of JavaScript. [1]
To clarify, there was around a fifteen year gap between Livewire and Node.js, so things were not quite as streamlined as you implied.
[0]: https://dev.to/macargnelutti/server-side-javascript-a-decade...
[1] https://www.oreilly.com/library/view/node-up-and/97814493322...
I'm glad this is being fought, Oracle is a demon. > The major implementations of JavaScript are in the browsers built by Mozilla, Google, Apple, and Microsoft Isn't MS's browser just Chromium? Weird to add them to the list when they don't build a browser any more. Why not add Brave, etc?
Earlier quoted context omitted.
which switches the backend from Chromium to Trident, effectively turning it into IE with a modern skin I wish they'd done the opposite instead: same UI, but with a better browser engine.
I wish someone recreated Netscape Navigator UI with the Gecko engine. I can't give any reasons, I just wish it.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I wish I could agree that Oracle are somehow acting in the interest of their shareholders but I fail to see how they benefit by spending hundreds of thousands on lawyers to try to protect a trademark that makes them zero revenue and on the whole damages their brand.
If they win, there’s a forever revenue stream to extract and they keep their TM law sharp.
I appreciate Ryan taking this up, and the updates are interesting. Obviously I'm not paying for the lawyers but it feels like "oh Oracle is trying to add months of delays" feels pretty normal. Only months! If the process just trudges along for a couple of years before reaching a "good" conclusion, still worth doing! And very happy that this is an actual legal proceeding and "try to sign a petition asking Oracle nicel…
Realistically, it's time for Microsoft to make some good karma, and give Javascript to the world. They should wrest this from Oracle. "Microsoft Edge: the browser that gave you as no one else could."
Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think it's necessarily fair to say Oracle is total crap. For decades they were more performant and had more features than most anything else on the market. They supported scale-out clustering on linux with Oracle RAC. They were early adopters of high performance NFS moving the NFS stack out of the linux kernel and directly into the database with DirectNFS. They built a clustered filesystem for block-based clu…
Yeah every argument about Oracle being bad is business related, not tech.
A) Performance was so terrible by default the DBAs were cops and had given up on real RDBMS performance tools such as indexes and keys (primary and foreign) and instead used a ton of arcane low level file management tools like Oracle was some sort of "build your own DB kit" and the out of the box one was terrible so they needed a bespoke hand built one
B) I was once in a CLI running some sort of very basic Select statement (no joins, because again, no keys; single table; maybe a couple of columns) and watched in horror as an entire Java-based debugger IDE not installed on my extremely locked down work machine launched, spun up, and dived deep, deep into a terrifying stacktrace comprising an awful mix of C++ and Java code. To this day I don't know how or why a Select statement (that worked the second time) crashed so hard into Oracle's own source code. It is possibly related to part A above, but I'm still not sure. I don't know why the debugger symbols much less actual source code from Oracle were even available when it did crash that hard. I did know at the time that actually debugging Oracle's code was very far above my pay grade and in addition to sending the debugger IDE they should have also attached a large check.
I think of that experience often when people tell me that Oracle actually has good tech. If it weren't obvious from how awful their tools are to use as a user (a different previous employer used Oracle's expensive time/attendance/payroll tools and those were the clunkiest, worst web apps to use), that brief, weird horror story of the Select statement in a CMD.EXE window REPL bringing up the wildest stack trace in a debugger that didn't exist on my machine will always leave me feeling doubtful about that.