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ChatGPT Search

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Re: ChatGPT Search

#171

I have turned bearish on Perplexity recently, this confirms it

Perplexity is a really terrible name for a product and that alone will hold it back from being a real competitor.

I've always thought that the name is very ironic and perhaps "certitude" would've been a better name.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#172
post #142

Genuine question: is there a present or planned value proposition for people like me who already have decent search skills? Or are these really for children/elders who (without making any normative claim about whether this is a good thing or not) can't be arsed to perform searches themselves? Does someone else have good search skills but mingle traditional search engines with LLMs anyways? Why? I use LLMs every day b…

I dunno, I'm not exactly on the AI bandwagon, but search is the one place where I use (and see others using) chatgpt all the time. The fact that Google search has been getting worse for a decade probably helps, but better search -- consistently done, without ads or cruft -- would be worth a few bucks every month for me.

I agree that you can't TRUST them, but half the links regular search turns up are also garbage, so that's not really worse, per se.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#173
post #142

Genuine question: is there a present or planned value proposition for people like me who already have decent search skills? Or are these really for children/elders who (without making any normative claim about whether this is a good thing or not) can't be arsed to perform searches themselves? Does someone else have good search skills but mingle traditional search engines with LLMs anyways? Why? I use LLMs every day b…

Even if you are good at writing the queries, Google is so terrible that you end up getting some blogspam etc. in there (or at least I do). A model filtering that out is useful, which I find phind pretty good for. Hopefully this will be even better.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#174
post #142

Genuine question: is there a present or planned value proposition for people like me who already have decent search skills? Or are these really for children/elders who (without making any normative claim about whether this is a good thing or not) can't be arsed to perform searches themselves? Does someone else have good search skills but mingle traditional search engines with LLMs anyways? Why? I use LLMs every day b…

I think it’s pretty clear that LLMs can process a document/article/web page faster than any human in order to answer a given question. (And it can be parallelized across multiple pages at once too).

The main hard part of searching isn’t formulating queries to write in the Google search bar, it’s clicking on links, and reading/skimming until you find the specific answer you want.

Getting one sentence direct answers is a much superior UX compared to getting 10 links you have to read through yourself.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#175
post #142

Genuine question: is there a present or planned value proposition for people like me who already have decent search skills? Or are these really for children/elders who (without making any normative claim about whether this is a good thing or not) can't be arsed to perform searches themselves? Does someone else have good search skills but mingle traditional search engines with LLMs anyways? Why? I use LLMs every day b…

I use GPT for things that would require multiple Google searches (research). Some examples..

- I count calories... eat out always and at somewhat healthy chains (Cava, Chipolte, etc). Tell GPT (via voice while driving to & or after eating) what ive eaten half the day at those places and then later for dinner. It calculates a calorie count estimation for half the day and then later at dinner the remaining. I have checked to see if GPT is getting the right calories for things off websites and it has.

- Have hiking friends who live an hour or two hours away and we hike once a month an hour or less drive is where we meet up and hike at a new place. GPT suggests such hikes and quickly (use to take many searches on Google to do such). Our drives to these new hikes learned from GPT have always been under an hour.

So far the information with those examples has been accurate. Always enjoy hearing how others use LLMs... what research are you getting done in one or two queries which used to take MANY google searches?

Re: ChatGPT Search

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given how many of those SEO spam sites are themselves generated by ChatGPT now, OpenAI can simply back-reference their own logs to find out which sites are probably SEO spam while everyone else is left guessing. That's vertical integration!

I’m sure they will be more subtle than that otherwise it will get circumvented. I’m sure they will/are tackling this at the model level. Train them to both generate good completions while also embedding text with good performance at separating generated and human text.

Would someone even want to circumvent it though? Most sites won't care very much about encouraging scrapers to include them in LLM training data, it's not like you get paid.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#177
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perplexity is a really terrible name for a product and that alone will hold it back from being a real competitor.

It's not like ChatGPT (or ChatGTP as half of people call it) is much better.

ChatGTP and other variants with a Levenshtein distance of 1 from ChatGPT have been typosquatted to death by subscriptionware wrappers on the App Store and the Play Store. Many of them seem to be quite successful.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#178
post #142

Genuine question: is there a present or planned value proposition for people like me who already have decent search skills? Or are these really for children/elders who (without making any normative claim about whether this is a good thing or not) can't be arsed to perform searches themselves? Does someone else have good search skills but mingle traditional search engines with LLMs anyways? Why? I use LLMs every day b…

I think this is just the first step for a full-featured agent that not only does searches for you, but also executes whatever was your goal (e.g. a restaurant reservation, etc)

To solve that problem you have to solve all the issues that make me not trust the results. As search, it's fine, since I am perusing and evaluating them. But as an agent, hallucinations and inaccurate answers have to disappear (or very close to disappear).

Re: ChatGPT Search

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly, if I can disable ads by paying them, then I'm ok with it. Google will suck all your data even if you pay, and link the entire earth of services to your identity. For now, chatgpt doesn't care, and I already pay for what they provide. May they kill Google. 20 years old me would freak out hearing me that, they used to be my heroes.

So the issue is if you let people opt out by paying you’re left with a low intent, likely lower net worth group of people to advertise to. As a result those eyeballs are worth less. The advertisers will turn to other platforms if you only let the worst people see their ads. Unless enough people all pay, the whole thing stops working. But there aren’t enough people who will pay because most people don’t care. Tldr: th…

There's some truth to that, but Netflix, YouTube, etc seem to be OK with both ad-supported and paid ad-free versions, so I think the logic you described does not always dominate the considerations.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#180
post #142

Genuine question: is there a present or planned value proposition for people like me who already have decent search skills? Or are these really for children/elders who (without making any normative claim about whether this is a good thing or not) can't be arsed to perform searches themselves? Does someone else have good search skills but mingle traditional search engines with LLMs anyways? Why? I use LLMs every day b…

I think you need to define "decent search skills" since google will straight up ignore most boolean stuff or return ads.

The LLMs are nice because they are not yet enshitified to the point of uselessness.

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