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CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

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Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#171

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

asynchronous wrote: post #98
defrost wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's running a business with under 50 employees, running a business with under 100, and then there's running a coorporation with several thousand and more employees. The FAANG (and other letter group) global mega corp survivors have one or two valid grievances.

This 100 times, especially because a large portion of HN is former FAANG. We’ve seen the secret sauce at the top, it’s not special.

> We’ve seen the secret sauce at the top, it’s not special.

I'm not at all saying all FAANG bosses are great, but I don't think I've ever seen anyone argue that all they do is "make a couple decisions a week and then play golf." Anyone that says that is just showing how clueless they are as to what goes in to running a large company.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#172

Post by astura »

fourseventy wrote: post #71
andirk wrote: post #35

CEOs of medium/large companies are the face of the company which means making a couple key decisions per week (a few work hours) and meeting with current/prospective clients (leisure activities). Coupled with making far more $ than the rest of the employees, I suspect they're both bored at the office and feel downgraded to a regular employee. Thus, out-of-office with nothing to show. But if the company is _coincident…

Everyone on this site is so anti-C-suite it's crazy. All the standard "big company CEO bad, me entry level employee good" talking points. You would think that a site based on entrepreneurship would have people on it that have more of an understanding of what running a business is actually like.

>You would think that a site based on entrepreneurship

Hacker News isn't that though, it's just an orange Reddit.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#173

Post by photonthug »

Gustomaximus wrote: post #154
photonthug wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Everyone on this site is so anti-C-suite it's crazy. All the standard "big company CEO bad, me entry level employee good" talking points. This condescending "entry level employee good" thing is total nonsense. It's absolutely common for many 30 year career stretches to never actually see a decent hard-working executive out in the wild. And if you do actually encounter one, then there's a decent chance that you also…

> It's absolutely common for many 30 year career stretches to never actually see a decent hard-working executive out in the wild. Really? In my bubble this is far from common and more likely ignorance to what executives are doing. Execs tend to become so because they are highly motivated people willing to dedicate themself to their jobs. I had an employee once would would constantly complain about their old bosses, a…

I bet your bubble congratulated you when you used your soft skills to encourage a problem employee to become a better contributor. Just curious though, could you actually do the job of this contributor? And if that employee had your own job in leadership, do you think they could maybe also come up with the creative idea that for solving personnel problems, one need only loom threateningly, and declare quietly "Maybe You're the Problem"? Very subtle. It's almost like a power difference solved the problem all by itself, without needing any problem solving skills.

I've had great bosses, but that's not what we're discussing. This is about executives. And while I agree that executives are certainly highly motivated, I just think that at a certain level mostly that is motivation to lie, misdirect, deflect, and steal. This also isn't about small businesses, which are much more likely to have legitimate entrepreneurs or merit-based processes, even at the top. For most medium-sized businesses and certainly for large ones, everything is different and anyone can see that pedigree, nepotism, and failing upwards all become more dominant factors. Take an honest look at yourself and your bubble and the line workers. Who can do who's job, really? Which work is more skilled?

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#174

Post by jandrewrogers »

andirk wrote: post #35

CEOs of medium/large companies are the face of the company which means making a couple key decisions per week (a few work hours) and meeting with current/prospective clients (leisure activities). Coupled with making far more $ than the rest of the employees, I suspect they're both bored at the office and feel downgraded to a regular employee. Thus, out-of-office with nothing to show. But if the company is _coincident…

I’ve worked closely with the CEOs of a few big companies. People see a few moments of glamor and think that is the job but the vast majority of what they do is an astonishingly shitty and thankless job. You have to be a certain kind of masochist to do what is required in that role day after day. You are also never off the clock, so they never really get a proper break to recharge and prevent burnout. No one with any sense would do that job for a normal paycheck and perks, it isn’t worth it.

The reality is that few people have the mental and psychological constitution required to do the job of CEO at any decent sized company. You don’t need to look further than startups to empirically know that most people, even when self-selecting, can’t do the job of CEO even when playing the easy mode of a small company.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#175

Post by heresie-dabord »

darth_avocado wrote: post #22
bearjaws wrote: post #2

Anyone surprised by this? I remember my first programming job it was FREQUENT that the execs would fly to other offices ~12+ weeks a year. Of course our office was in Orlando so every exec would also magically have their family flown in as well to go to Disney World. 5 jobs later, its been the same at any company that isn't a startup. Execs have never been in the office, they have "offsite" meetings.

Not only are directors and above immune to the RTO directives in most companies, they are also immune to location specific pay ranges in most companies. And for the few times they do require to go to the office, they can expense the entire trip, including airfare, dinners, hotels and more. The class asymmetry is ridiculous, but unfortunately most workers don’t know this fact. Edit: In case it wasn’t clear, this is no…

> The class asymmetry is ridiculous, but unfortunately most workers don’t know this fact.

Class asymmetry exists by design.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#176

Post by BobbyTables2 »

Alupis wrote: post #110
mempko wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like, not even with a computer?

Yet somehow it's the ones with computers, earning significantly above average income, writing and reading this now. You can start a company on a library computer...

Starting a company is easy. Just a few short forms and a small fee…

Developing and selling a product (at a profit) that someone actually buys — not so easy.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#177

Post by sbrother »

tayo42 wrote: post #168
borplk wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes and some people don't appreciate that some jobs really do require quiet focus for extended periods of time. Asking someone to be a programmer in a loud chaotic open office environment is not dissimilar to asking them to program while juggling two balls and sitting on a unicycle. Its just excess difficulty that doesn't need to be added on top of the jobs.

in hindsight its amazing anything actually ever got done

Realistically the actual work got done in the evening after going home.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#178

Post by bsder »

kolbe wrote: post #122
itake wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way I have started looking at it is CEOs/founders won the lottery. They control the keys, but they share a tiny fraction of the gold with the employees. I come to this conclusion, b/c I think its extremely rare that the 'best' person to be the executive on day0 is rarely the 'best' person to be an executive in every stage of a company's lifecycle. but the executives can cling on, b/c they have low accountability…

Chipotle's stock dropped 10% and Starbucks's rose 25% when the CEO switched from one to the other this past week. If this guy is just a meritless lottery winner, then you can make a lot of money betting against the market and the extremely large group of heavily motivated and intelligent investors who think otherwise.

"The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent."

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#179

Post by icehawk »

fourseventy wrote: post #75
davidmurphy wrote: post #37

Workers should not return to the office. WFH or remote work should be permanent for all -- CEOs and low level staffers.

[flagged]

Something wrong with them getting out of the way of people who actually need to go somewhere to do their jobs?

A office worker having to drive somewhere to look at a screen they can have at home, shouldn't be an impediment to a nurse that has a real job that requires them to be where they work.

Re: CEOs are running companies from afar even as workers return to office

#180

Post by cycomanic »

zooq_ai wrote: post #73
bearjaws wrote: post #2

Anyone surprised by this? I remember my first programming job it was FREQUENT that the execs would fly to other offices ~12+ weeks a year. Of course our office was in Orlando so every exec would also magically have their family flown in as well to go to Disney World. 5 jobs later, its been the same at any company that isn't a startup. Execs have never been in the office, they have "offsite" meetings.

[flagged]

I don't understand your point are you saying that most CEOs are founders who started the company? I am willing to bet that this not even true for startups but it is certainly not true for your average CEO.

Also funny thing, typically people consider the "golden area" of US capitalism on which most of current prosperity is built the 50s and 60s, the ratio between exec pay and average employee pay is orders of magnitude different now. Interestingly, the US has lost most of its engineering and manufacturing abilities in the same time. Not sure if that is an indication of the greatest country in the world.

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