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I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

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Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#171

Post by kelnos »

The_Colonel wrote: post #22
1GZ0 wrote: post #17

Ladybird has garnered a level of mainstream attention that SerenityOS never really managed to. The browser has the potential to impact many more people, and the project is well funded by large investors. It makes sense that Andreas would shift his focus to LadyBird at this point. While Safari is busy being Safari and Firefox is busy eating glue in the corner, I'd love to see LadyBird become a real contender in the br…

I agree (apart from the popular hate on Firefox). Ladybird is promising and has a much bigger chance to make an impact than SerenityOS. But it's a bit disappointing to see that it's still pretty much a one-man project. Especially to have a chance to get close to the performance of Chrome and Firefox, it will need a large investment. The amount of engineering resources poured into just making JavaScript fast is mind-n…

I don't think that was intended to be hate on Firefox itself, but hate on the general mismanagement of the project by Mozilla. Firefox itself may not be in the corner sniffing glue, but it often feels like much of the decision-making at Mozilla is glue-sniffing-fueled.

(Happy Firefox user here; I still don't understand why anyone who cares even the tiniest bit about privacy or an open web is using Chrome.)

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#172

Post by Zetaphor »

culi wrote: post #166
1GZ0 wrote: post #17

Ladybird has garnered a level of mainstream attention that SerenityOS never really managed to. The browser has the potential to impact many more people, and the project is well funded by large investors. It makes sense that Andreas would shift his focus to LadyBird at this point. While Safari is busy being Safari and Firefox is busy eating glue in the corner, I'd love to see LadyBird become a real contender in the br…

> I'd love to see LadyBird become a real contender in the browser market At this pace it would likely take decades just for them to be complete enough to show up on MDN or wpt.fyi But I agree. With Microsoft ditching their independent Edge and becoming Chromium-based and Opera doing the same we're really down to 3 real engines. The best fourth option we can get are Goanna-based browsers like Pale Moon which are thems…

> At this pace it would likely take decades just for them to be complete enough to show up on MDN or wpt.fyi

The important thing to keep in mind with this announcement is that the glacial pace was previously a restriction of being attached to SerenityOS. Everything needed to be built from scratch with no reliance on third party libraries. Now that they're detaching from Serenity they can start reaping the benefits of the existing work in the FOSS ecosystem, which should enable a faster pace of development.

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#173

Post by cassepipe »

HeckFeck wrote: post #126
nacs wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Firefox user, this exactly. The amount of things that now need to be toggled off on a new install are approaching Windows “telemetry” levels: disable sponsored shortcuts on homepage, disable experimental “Studies”, sponsored suggestions in search bar, “suggested extensions”, Pocket, and the list goes on. I really need to look into a privacy friendly fork of FF..

> I really need to look into a privacy friendly fork of FF.. I'd love to make the jump too, just that I rely upon FF sync too much. It's handy getting your bookmarks and other details on mobile devices. The other forks look to be desktop only.

True, it's very handy... but can't Chrome do it with a Google account ? (I really don't know)

To me the really seeling point of firefox is being able to switch off search suggestions. Now the bar only searches opened Tabs, history, bookmarks and I can tab into them quickly. If nothing turns up, pressing Enter will still launch a search. Being able to do casual navigation without having to go through a search engine is a killer feature (and it's better for the planet).

Not only tab but you can search directly into opened Tabs/history/bookmarks with the right %/^/* symbols !

EDIT : Almost forgot, it only really shines with that extension that prevent searches to turn up in your history --> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/history-autod...

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#174

Post by svnt »

robertlagrant wrote: post #113
ZiiS wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

KHTML+KJS released in 1998, via WebKit from 2001, in 2008 it gained the Chrome name, but the code has more than 20 years of legacy.

> KHTML+KJS released in 1998, via WebKit from 2001, in 2008 it gained the Chrome name, but the code has more than 20 years of legacy. Why do you want the oldest code to be less than 20 years old? Why is that "nice"?

The last time a major browser originated, RAM was measured in MB, CPU freq in MHz, and the iPod was the thing that the one trend hunter your friend knew was about to buy.

The major browser platform today, smartphones, did not exist. PDAs did not even have wireless internet yet.

The basis for the functionality of the browser is due for a reimagining.

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#175

Post by adastra22 »

skeaker wrote: post #162
nacs wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Firefox user, this exactly. The amount of things that now need to be toggled off on a new install are approaching Windows “telemetry” levels: disable sponsored shortcuts on homepage, disable experimental “Studies”, sponsored suggestions in search bar, “suggested extensions”, Pocket, and the list goes on. I really need to look into a privacy friendly fork of FF..

This is an extremely uncharitable view of Firefox and an outrageously generous view of Windows. The things you listed take 2 checkboxes in a new tab window, 2 checkboxes in settings (which has a search bar that takes you right to them by just searching "studies" or "data collection"), 2 checkboxes in settings (search "suggestions"), 2 clicks (right click the pocket button and click hide)... The only tricky one is the…

I cannot tell if this is sarcasm or not.

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#176

Post by doublerabbit »

arp242 wrote: post #167
doublerabbit wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So? You should still develop for. Why? For this whole reason. What does it matter? You should target all audiences. Why not?

Make a patch for FreeBSD if you care about it. Pick up maintainership to ensure it keeps working. That's how this works. Andreas is not your bitch.

[flagged]

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#177

Post by doublerabbit »

adamrt wrote: post #136
doublerabbit wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So? You should still develop for. Why? For this whole reason. What does it matter? You should target all audiences. Why not?

> You should target all audiences. Here is a list of OSes[0]. Where do you draw the line on supporting these? Should every new project try to support all of these? Do you, doublerabbit, get to decide which OSes are important enough for support? Or do you think the person who created the project and does all the work should be able to decide where to spend their free time? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_ope…

> Where do you draw the line on supporting these?

Where those are still in active development. Where those exist you should attempt at least for. It's partly why they failed in the first place.

> Should every new project try to support all of these?

As said above, attempt. My projects in Perl work most places, my TCL programs do too. C and C++ all have been universes. Heck even Python.

It's only new fangled languages like Rust and Go that make an ball ache.

> Do you, doublerabbit, get to decide which OSes are important enough for support?

Yeah why not, at least allowed to voice an opinion. I'm so sick and tired seeing the world of IT on repeat. See it get abused, capitalised and freedom sucked from it. I give Linux five more years before it will be smothered in corporate.

After working as an sysadmin from the age of 13, to 35. I wish I could call done but other opportunities are not feasible at this time. The amount of bug reports I've submitted across the board is more than a dozen. Hand crafted brittle configuration files, been there done that. This isn't just me being edgy.

For more the past twenty years we've only dominated one bloody OS. Only then do we all bitch at each other because of fanboi or whatever cliche is at the moment. Systemd comes to mind.

I am so bored of the neo-Linux crowd and I've been working with it for it since 2.x kernel.

Only when you jump off the bandwagon do you see how clunky it really is.

First HN was shouting at me how a new browser could never be made and now HN is jumping up and down because one has yet won't acknowledge that other OS exist and that I personally feel developers should catered for.

Is this like to real for everyone or something?

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#178

Post by pawelmurias »

qalmakka wrote: post #3

I guess SerenityOS is somewhat doomed now? I never saw this kind of move ending well, honestly. Even when not involved, having the original around is always a great boon to the popularity of a project. I for one would love to see the SerenityOS GUI ported to Wayland on Windows. It's precisely what I ask for from an OS honestly.

If it is something people hack on for fun why would it be doomed because of one guy leaving or their web browser getting forked?

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#179

Post by doublerabbit »

zellyn wrote: post #170
doublerabbit wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, why not.

What about TempleOS? I think if you care, go help them make Ladybird work on your OS. People who make software for fun and give it away for free owe all of us precisely nothing: I believe that’s a very important principle, otherwise they’ll just burn out as their hobby project turns into a grind.

What about TempleOS?

There's practically and not so practical.

Re: I'm forking Ladybird and stepping down as SerenityOS BDFL

#180

Post by arp242 »

doublerabbit wrote: post #176
arp242 wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Make a patch for FreeBSD if you care about it. Pick up maintainership to ensure it keeps working. That's how this works. Andreas is not your bitch.

[flagged]

People like you is why people burn out from open source. Can't create anything without random nobodies who spend zero effort on anything shouting at you and hurling insults at you. You're being a completely toxic asshole.
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