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Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

curingaddiction.substack.com

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Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#171

Post by makeitdouble »

glp1guide wrote: post #130
makeitdouble wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't the worry that Ozempic is only "effective and save" as far as all the other weight loss drugs being utter predatory bullshit ? Last time I looked into it the "loss" is only happening while taking the medication and you get back to normal once you stop, regardless of how long you’ve been taking it. So if stabilizing at a thinner state is your goal, the drug would be mostly useless or you should be ready to take…

> Isn't the worry that Ozempic is only "effective and save" as far as all the other weight loss drugs being utter predatory bullshit ? Yes, but note that there are other more legitimate alternatives like gastric bypass, etc! > Last time I looked into it the "loss" is only happening while taking the medication and you get back to normal once you stop, regardless of how long you’ve been taking it. So if stabilizing at…

> This is untrue -- most people do not bounce all the way back to their original weight once they stop, and simply having the space from what seems to anecdotally be quite annoying symptoms ("food noise") might be well worth it.

5% weight loss at the end of the day, and no cardio metabolic improvement [0]. So basically the net change was super small and cosmetic. I understand this could still be useful for very specific cases, but it's more of a niche that we're willing to admit.

> the mechanism of action is completely different

I hear you, I and I think we'll see more and more diverse drugs with different mechanisms. I'm just not sure we should be saying "this time it's different" every single time when we could take more measured approach before pushing it to the masses. Right now we're already in the YOLO phase waiting to see how it will pan out now that everyone and their dog want the miracle weight loss drug.

[0] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35441470/

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#172

Post by throwup238 »

lamontcg wrote: post #153
glp1guide wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well quality of the compounder/pharmacy is the real issue here -- of course it's not that the process itself is flawed, more that it's basically impossible for a layman consumer to inspect/assess quality/safety.

How does the layman consumer inspect/assess the quality/safety of other drugs or really any other substance that they ingest?

That's a fair question - they obviously can't inspect pharmaceutical factories. That said, the FDA has much more power to regulate drug manufacturers than pharmacists and most drugs are manufactured in a few locations that are much easier to inspect. They only have to make sure one or two locations are set up correctly and a significant chunk of the application for clinical trials is quality control procedures.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#173

Post by throwup238 »

scarmig wrote: post #22
Xenoamorphous wrote: post #9

I'm not very familiar with the approval process for new drugs, but as far as I know it involves some initial step where the safety is assessed, and then the effectiveness. But I don't think either of those are actually long term processes (like, longer than 5 years). So it scares me a bit when something like Ozepmic pops up and tons of people jump on it, without knowing the long term effects that might appear. I read…

There's always tradeoffs. Ozempic probably has some long term side effects, but are they worse than obesity? Probably not. (And an intervention based on ozempic is far more likely to cause lasting change than one based on a prescribed behavioral program.)

> (And an intervention based on ozempic is far more likely to cause lasting change than one based on a prescribed behavioral program.)

I was under the impression that for lasting change the behavioral program was pretty much required anyway, unless the patient wants to take Ozempic for the rest of their life. It helps someone go from obese to the point where they can exercise to maintain their health but they still have to eat healthy and exercise afterwards.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#174

Post by bobmcnamara »

globular-toast wrote: post #117

We could also clamp down on addictive shit like Doritos and Oreos like we did with tobacco. Unbelievable that people will need to take a drug to escape the treachery of junk food companies everywhere you turn.

Increasing and sustaining corn syrup consumption has been a key republican party strategy to win over rural farmers and agribusiness since the 70s. I just don't see them changing.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#175

Post by krainboltgreene »

adam_arthur wrote: post #42
raziel2701 wrote: post #17

Ozempic costs $1000/month (in the US) but $5/month to manufacture [0]. I think if this drug and others are to have a significant anti-consumption effect on other companies it needs to be vastly more accessible, which first requires more accessible healthcare in the US, which is unlikely to happen. Also it's an injection, which raises the barrier. If drugs like these become orally administered and over-the-counter, th…

You can buy pharmacy compounded semaglutide through online portals, e.g. Ro It's $450/month out of pocket (no insurance coverage) Therefor, there will actually be price competition and we should see pretty cheap prices in the coming years. I'm not sure exactly why pharmacies are free to compound it independently. I guess whatever patents exist on Ozempic/Wegovy etc aren't sufficient to squash competition. The $1000/m…

> Therefor, there will actually be price competition and we should see pretty cheap prices in the coming years.

Considering how man times pharmaceutical companies have been lightly taken to task for doing the exact opposite, this seems extremely optimistic.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#176

Post by krainboltgreene »

robert2020 wrote: post #92
raziel2701 wrote: post #17

Ozempic costs $1000/month (in the US) but $5/month to manufacture [0]. I think if this drug and others are to have a significant anti-consumption effect on other companies it needs to be vastly more accessible, which first requires more accessible healthcare in the US, which is unlikely to happen. Also it's an injection, which raises the barrier. If drugs like these become orally administered and over-the-counter, th…

Money to be made. Competitors will enter the market. Oral options will be come eventually. Prices will drop. Don’t distort the natural market with price controls. You’ll get less product options and higher costs. With all the obesity, this is going to be a gravy train.

> Prices will drop

This seems incredibly optimistic considering all of pharmaceutical history in the united states.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#177

Post by sniggers »

akgoel wrote: post #7
lispisok wrote: post #3

I had the thought there are gonna be some people on these drugs who will still find a way to have bad diets that keeps them fat and unhealthy. Since they have less appetite instead of a sandwich and a milkshake they will skip to the milkshake only.

When I was on Ozempic, I just didn't want the milkshake. It rewires all reward centers.

For me, it's just less hunger and being full faster. I still want the milkshake, just a smaller one and less often.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#178

Post by alfiedotwtf »

s1k3s wrote: post #31
raziel2701 wrote: post #17

Ozempic costs $1000/month (in the US) but $5/month to manufacture [0]. I think if this drug and others are to have a significant anti-consumption effect on other companies it needs to be vastly more accessible, which first requires more accessible healthcare in the US, which is unlikely to happen. Also it's an injection, which raises the barrier. If drugs like these become orally administered and over-the-counter, th…

> As Chairman of the Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions (HELP), I am calling on Novo Nordisk to lower the list price of Ozempic – and the related drug Wegovy – in America to no more than what they charge for this drug in Canada. I'm not aware of how legislation works in US but I feel like a senator should have more power than just "calling on" a company?

If obesity is an “epidemic”, and the US just forced TikTok to sell based on national security concerns, what’s stopping Uncle Sam commandeering Novo to either sell off its Ozempic ownership as a subsidiary to force a lower general sales price, or forcing to nullify its patents?

I’m speaking legally rather than economically. If the US Gov did this, big pharma would stop investing in research (even though I wouldn’t be surprised if USG pays for the private research in the first place) and cause worldwide slowdown in new medicines all in the name of profits

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#179

Post by fragmede »

mmcnl wrote: post #155
tyre wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Semaglutide has been on the market since 2017 and clinical trials commenced in 2008. So we have a fair amount of data on longer-term users. It wasn't being used for general obesity until recently.

But has it had long-term studies as a weight-loss drug instead of a diabetes treatment? The results might be different.

it might be, but the question is if there's some long term bad effect, like it causes brain bleeds if you take it for 20 years or something. I don't think patients taking it for weight-loss instead of diabetes changes the underlying biological processes that happens as a result of taking the medication, so long term studies based on diabetes patients is useful information for non-diabetes patients.

Re: Ozempic will disrupt big tobacco, candy companies, and alcohol brands

#180

Post by trogdor »

slfnflctd wrote: post #24

If these drugs turn out to be significantly more effective for a wide range of addictions than past approaches, that would indeed be a major societal shift. I wouldn't try any of them right now, but if my insurance covered one for treating alcoholism at some point I'd give it a shot. If it actually worked it would likely significantly improve not only my life experience, but also my productivity and thereby the lives…

Have you considered naltrexone?
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