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Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

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Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#171

Post by constantcrying »

PeterisP wrote: post #170
constantcrying wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seeing actual footage from Ukraine, actually has made me extremely uncomfortable working for a company, which produces equipment for that conflict. But maybe I am one of those insane people who doesn't want to see people slaughter each other. It seems like once there was "the right" enemy people actually are very much in favor of foreign military adventures and war. Pretty pathetic.

I understand that the attitude towards overseas "military adventures" can reasonably be quite different, but coming from that region, I feel that it's morally good (not even acceptable/neutral) to volunteer and join the army, risking your life to defend your people with force of arms that may involve killing of enemy soldiers. And since that is morally okay, for the person who actually is pulling the trigger - then t…

Ah okay. I mistook you for an American who just flipflops on whatever is currently pushed, but I see that you are just a nationalist. Which I think is far more acceptable, if you actually are not a hypocrite about it, like being a nationalist for a country where you do not live in or don't even have a citizenship for.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#172

Post by yanderekko »

CPLX wrote: post #168
yanderekko wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, well, I still can't help but find it odd that such "blatant" crimes are apparently the reach of the legal system. My prior under the circumstances is that the claims are overblown, eg. "Iraqi soldiers are murderers" or "all contractors that aided the US intelligence apparatus belong to criminal organizations".

This conversation is really confusing. Has there ever been an era in American history where there aren’t private entities with high government officials as allies who engage in organized criminal activity to further our international trade interests while avoiding consequences? Not sure if you’re a history buff, but…

Yeah, but if the insinuation is that the whole military-industrial complex is largely a "criminal enterprise" it becomes a much less interesting claim.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#173

Post by yanderekko »

dariosalvi78 wrote: post #159
yanderekko wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also we have to solve climate change without using any fancy-shmancy geoengineering, because as sinners we're obligated to suffer rather than have convenient solutions for our problems.

we could go with untested, still inefficient fancy-shmancy geoengineering which may cause even greater disasters, or maybe we could go with re-engineering our energy systems, with solutions that have been used for decades, if not centuries, at the same time maybe also rethinking a bit the way we live and consume. But, no, where's the fun if we don't destroy an ecosystem or two?

If a sober-minded cost-benefit analysis concludes that geo-engineering isn't viable, fine. But I don't think this is the modal way that geoengineering is being dismissed.

Also these are similar arguments to what has been used to criticize nuclear energy for decades, which has obviously been a disaster on net.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#174

Post by sixstringtheory »

constantcrying wrote: post #167
PeterisP wrote: post #165

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion there's nothing wrong with being part of the military-industrial complex - as recent developments have shown, defence industry is a fundamental need for any modern society including democratic ones, and we're voting to increase funding for military personnel and hardware (part of which gets bought from the US), and getting volunteers from all fields of technology involved in applying hardware and softwa…

Seeing actual footage from Ukraine, actually has made me extremely uncomfortable working for a company, which produces equipment for that conflict. But maybe I am one of those insane people who doesn't want to see people slaughter each other. It seems like once there was "the right" enemy people actually are very much in favor of foreign military adventures and war. Pretty pathetic.

> But maybe I am one of those insane people who doesn't want to see people slaughter each other.

I share your ideal but realistically this is a useless stance if there is anyone in the world that doesn’t share your ideal and doesn’t mind slaughtering others.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#175

Post by dariosalvi78 »

_8ts0 wrote: post #156
dariosalvi78 wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I consider nuclear fusion for energy production highly speculative too, meanwhile our houses burn.

The point isn't whether you agree with the approach, it's that it's not intellectually honest to claim nobody who considers AI to have existential risks thinks we should do anything about climate change and not eg. mention that Altman's biggest investment is to fight climate change. Good discourse only happens when people take efforts to honestly represent the state of affairs.

Still haven't heard anybody who says we should stop developing AI that we should also stop, say, driving cars or stop all datacenters. Yes both are drastic, maybe even silly, but one is a response to a real threat affecting the planet here and now, the other is a the result of a vivid fantasy.

Happy to be given counter examples.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#177

Post by Sporktacular »

Only those with “no products” want a pause.

I presume he means among producers of AI products. But factoring in others (like researchers, lawmakers, concerned citizens, me, Sarah Connor) you could flip that around to 'only those with products don't want a pause'. Which is a bit like meth producers not wanting to surrender their labs.

But something tells me Alex Karp isn't concerned about ethics.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#178

Post by Sporktacular »

ChumpGPT wrote: post #38
imiric wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Karp believes that the West currently holds key commercial and military advantages in AI and should not relinquish them. Delusional take, considering the East holds the AI advantage.

Yeah, I'm sure you have better insight and way more knowledge about the state of AI than Karp. What does he know anyway. It's not like Plantir has any special access to AI or the US Military.

He has a vested interest in saying what is necessary to prevent regulation.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#179

Post by Sporktacular »

ng12 wrote: post #150
SushiHippie wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Airbus uses Palantir Foundry, which I think is not that controversial. The controversial things everyone talks about are their other products like Gotham which is for the police/military. In germany it is Unconstitutional to use. Here is a german article about it: https://www.hessenschau.de/politik/warum-die-polizei-softwar...

So you're saying selling any sort of data analytics software to the government is a criminal act?

If it breaks the laws of the land you can call it illegal. And without doubt immoral if it's used to mass control and surveil populations.

Re: Palantir CEO Rejects Calls to Pause AI Development

#180

Post by ng12 »

Sporktacular wrote: post #179
ng12 wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you're saying selling any sort of data analytics software to the government is a criminal act?

If it breaks the laws of the land you can call it illegal. And without doubt immoral if it's used to mass control and surveil populations.

Immorality is a tricky subject but the original commenter was specifically talking about illegality. Whatever your feelings about Palantir's business (and the defense contracting business as a whole) I don't think there's any convincing argument that Palantir is engaged in illegal or illicit business.
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