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Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

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Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#171
post #59

I see this kind of thing over and over. It’s a symptom of a larger problem: We are building communities on closed platforms that we don’t control. We need to move from Feudalism to a Free Market: https://qbix.com/blog/2021/01/15/open-source-communities/ When you choose where to host your Wordpress or whatever, you don’t worry about someone shutting off the API keys. On this page is a video explaining how that would w…

> We are building communities on closed platforms that we don’t control. We need to move from Feudalism to a Free Market A free market literally overrun by Nazis is what that means in the end. It's best seen on all the Twitter clone attempts that marketed themselves as "free speech" alternatives - most notably Parler, Gab and Truth Social: they all ended up being echo chambers of Nazis, where no one but them would wa…

That’s a fixable problem.

First of all — if you are so worried about being overrun by nazis, you should worry about being overrun by bots, who could gradually astruturf any ideology including nazism or 4chan QAnon or recruiting of incels into jihadism or something as simple as “let’s go to war against China”. (And furthermore, Carthage delendum est.) It is far more insidious because it would be done as a coordinated, long-term swarm attack. A persistent advanced threat, in all communities, available to anyone to deploy. All open communities would turn into a dark forest and you’ll cry out to Zuck and Elon to save you, and trust them even more.

That is why we will soon all be moving to private communities where we — not Zuck or Elon’s algorithms — select who we hear from, and where membership is grandfathered in and/or depends on actually showing up to events in person once in a while and interacting (gasp, you mean like, BEFORE the Internet? When people had fulfilling social lives?)

Rather than preventing people from forming their own communities, you should support open source tools that give them access to their own infrastructure. If they want to label Nagorno-Karabakh on their copy of OpenStreetMap “Armenia” or “Azerbaijan”, they can, and don’t have to kill each other in the name of The State flags.

How about if we each have our own private keychains to sign what we say, rather than Facebook and Google’s “real names” policy (which Google apologized for) or their centralized sign-in which basicallly controls your identity? Or CBDCs and National IDs from The State which are coming? Or even worse, scanning your eyeballs by “Worldcoin” founded by the same OpenAI guys who promised to be open nonprofit and later became closed for-profit?

Tell me, when you are jacked into a metaverse for 10 hours a day (eg for work and some fun), would you want it to be owned by a corporation, their world and you just live in it? Are you preferring to trust Facebook, a company that has surreptitiously spied on your audio and your camera every chance they got until they got caught?

We have perfectly good Web2 solutions like Verified Claims and certificate chains, for many of these things, and you can watch my interviews with the technologists who actually roll it out, such as:

Private Keys and Civic Participation: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GRzVj2W9WGM

Founder of Freenet, the first decentralized encrypted file sharing platform: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JWrRqUkJpMQ

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The design language follows all modern social media apps: engagement. Think TikTok. This means auto-playing videos, large elements instead of small elements (low information density) designed to draw attention, prioritising popular and contentious items in the feed instead of relevant items for the user, etc. This language is user-hostile. It uses psychological techniques to keep users on the platform for longer inst…

> auto-playing videos, large elements instead of small elements You can fix both these issues in the app settings. Turning off feed thumbnails is also a big improvement.

> You can fix both these issues in the app settings. Turning off feed thumbnails is also a big improvement.

You cannot. The "classic" layout is still less information dense than Apollo, and disabling autoplay only disables autoplaying videos in the "card" layout. Videos still auto-play once a user taps a submission.

While we're here, I forgot how hostile their navigation menu is. At the bottom of the app Reddit has "Home," "Discover," "Create," "Chat," and "Inbox." The latter doesn't even take one to their inbox. It takes them to their *activity." These are clearly not the most used actions on Reddit. They're the actions Reddit wants to encourage.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the official Reddit apps sucks big ass in my opinion. Combine this with the way Reddit nags and misleads you to install it, and that gave me enough reason to never use their fucking app.

Having tried to use Apollo several times over several years, I keep coming back to the official Reddit app. It works and I'm just used to it. I like the UI much better and it feels normal. Nothing Apollo provides was that much of an improvement over the default app IMO.

Are you a dev for the app or Reddit employee? The official app is a case study in bad UX design. The only positive reviews in the app store are easily identified as bot or part of paid for campaigns. The recent reviews though tell how more average users view the official app…and it’s not very good.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

/r/politics has leaked into virtually every subreddit.

The issue is that the admins only selectively enforce their rules, and are very ideologically driven at that (see the general rule of not allowing bans for other subreddit participation). This sets the tone for the moderation.

The administrators still maintain that racism can only be by an oppressor group to an oppressed group. That is, they ignore reports of racism against white people. Last year I saw a user get a temporary ban for reporting racism against white people. The rot is from the top down.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#175
post #7

I really hope one of the bigger third party apps finds a way to just point their front end to a reddit clone and eat reddits lunch.

I keep hearing this, but how many of reddit users actually use third party apps? If Twitter proved anything, its that its really hard to kill a popular social media network, no matter how badly managed or drama filled it is.

I believe the estimate is 18-20%. This is roughly 86 billion monthly active users. More than enough to populate an active community. I hazard to guess that third party app users are also more active.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#176
post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm now envisioning a sci-fi future where the AIs are an embodiment of xkcd #606. Far better than humans at mundane tasks but with significantly outdated cultural knowledge.

There are humans today that refer to Africa as the 'third world' even though it's a continent with countries more developed than some US states or European countries. Significant outdated cultural knowledge seems the norm for humans too.

As someone in a US state with blackouts to our power grid, I'm wondering what more developed things you might be referring to and I might be missing out on.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We are building communities on closed platforms that we don’t control. We need to move from Feudalism to a Free Market A free market literally overrun by Nazis is what that means in the end. It's best seen on all the Twitter clone attempts that marketed themselves as "free speech" alternatives - most notably Parler, Gab and Truth Social: they all ended up being echo chambers of Nazis, where no one but them would wa…

Perhaps not being able to run trending topic campaigns is a _draw_ for Masto users. Not being able to create your own means you don't have to be spammed with attempts from others.

For me, the experience of Mastodon is worse than Twitter - essentially, either you follow the global firehose feed, or you're limited to the small amount of content your direct followings create or re-toot.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#179
post #2

In another thread about this, someone mentioned Lemmy, a federated alternative to Reddit: https://lemmy.one/communities/listing_type/All/page/1 Looks like an interesting approach.

The problem I see with lemmy, mastodon and similar services (anybody remember the also open source "Facebook killer" from like 10 years ago?) is that they are confusing: is it one service or a bunch of servers? Which server is the good one? The average is lost on the first page, and you need her for these social based apps. You need the non tech savvy people to get communities like r/medicine. Otherwise you get shat…

To argue your point, today on Lemmy.ml the owner advised users the server could not handle the load, and told users to register on other instances (https://lemmy.ml/post/1147770?scrollToComments=true). This would mean multiple logins. There is no way to migrate or synchronise accounts. Federation is a cool idea but Lemmy's implementation is a terrible user experience.

Re: Major Reddit communities will go dark to protest threat to third-party apps

#180
post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm now envisioning a sci-fi future where the AIs are an embodiment of xkcd #606. Far better than humans at mundane tasks but with significantly outdated cultural knowledge.

There are humans today that refer to Africa as the 'third world' even though it's a continent with countries more developed than some US states or European countries. Significant outdated cultural knowledge seems the norm for humans too.

Are they using "third world" in its original sense of non-alignment?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Third_World

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