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Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

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Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#171

Post by [deleted] »

ajross wrote: post #109
basisword wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of high profile tech bros on Twitter using the death to further their own views was disgraceful. SF may have big issues but using someone’s murder to further your political beliefs is horrible. I’m sure we won’t hear any retraction though.

Watching from outside, the whole "Tech Bros vs. Woke Hippies" framing is just nuts. It's at most a local politics dispute over control over the SF city government. And yet it's spilled over into all kinds of radicalized global thinking. People like pg and Garry are out there on twitter acting like the nutjobs trying to deny their startup workers housing and teach their kids about colonialism as a history paradigm are…

[deleted]

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#172

Post by cemerick »

stickfigure wrote: post #135
cemerick wrote: post #2

This news really highlights the confirmation bias that was in full bloom throughout the "discourse" around the initial reports of Lee's murder (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35448899 ). Everyone is so quick to jump on negative news about the rare violent crime in e.g. SF thanks to feelings about petty property crime that it's obviously impossible to have any kind of fact-based dialogue about policy. Worth…

It feels a bit like you're championing a narrative of "See, it's not so bad! You'll just get your stuff stolen and your car vandalized!" I wouldn't feel so smug about that. I lived in SF for ~15 years, experienced multiple car breakins (when I had a car) and one weird guy who walked up to me on the street and said "I have a gun and I'm going to shoot you" (which I somehow calmly ignored). For the record, I didn't com…

The only thing I'm "championing" (just pointing out, really) is that certain populations seem to enjoy using anecdotal tragedy to promote their own quasi-apocalyptic worldview re: some American cities, despite all available data contradicting that worldview.

I'm sure everyone here appreciates the update on your locale, and your own stories of property crime and/or non-criminal (yet perhaps unnerving?) personal interactions. Alas, none of that appears to be relevant to either the submitted story, or homicide or any other violent crime.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#173

Post by grogenaut »

reddog wrote: post #143
cemerick wrote: post #2

This news really highlights the confirmation bias that was in full bloom throughout the "discourse" around the initial reports of Lee's murder (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35448899 ). Everyone is so quick to jump on negative news about the rare violent crime in e.g. SF thanks to feelings about petty property crime that it's obviously impossible to have any kind of fact-based dialogue about policy. Worth…

> including current faves Austin and Miami Austin has 2.57 murders and nonnegligent manslaughters per 100K. Same year, SF has 6.35 per 100K. So SF is twice as bad as Austin. Your right about Miami though. But 6.35 isn't bad. The murder rate in St Louis (for comparision to the US city with the worst) is 66.07 per 100K. And Colima Mexico (worst in the world maybe) is 182 murders per 100K. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/…

I grew up in St Louis. We didn't worry so much about murder for cause as someone had to specifically dislike you (cheating on/with spouse for example). We just watched the street crime rates.

That said moving to the west coast people freak out all the time about yearly murder rates that are a weekend in STL.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#174

Post by ecshafer »

rootusrootus wrote: post #74
cemerick wrote: post #2

This news really highlights the confirmation bias that was in full bloom throughout the "discourse" around the initial reports of Lee's murder (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35448899 ). Everyone is so quick to jump on negative news about the rare violent crime in e.g. SF thanks to feelings about petty property crime that it's obviously impossible to have any kind of fact-based dialogue about policy. Worth…

Thanks for that. I admit to buying the narrative. Part of that is because my nearest city of any substance is Portland, and it's not especially violent. SF does look more violent compared to Portland, but objectively SF is actually just average or less. Lots of big cities are more violent[0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_cities_b...

I went to Portland for a week last year. I saw 6 different instances of a violent, obviously mentally ill, presumably homeless person physically attack a random person (once at a restaurant, twice at a tram station, thrice on the street, all broad daylight). That was more instances that I had seen in 5 years in Philadelphia, a city jokingly referred to as Killadelphia.

Portland might not have a lot of gang violence (which is what really gets numbers up), but not violent isn't how I would describe the city.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#175

Post by jeffbee »

ajross wrote: post #109
basisword wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of high profile tech bros on Twitter using the death to further their own views was disgraceful. SF may have big issues but using someone’s murder to further your political beliefs is horrible. I’m sure we won’t hear any retraction though.

Watching from outside, the whole "Tech Bros vs. Woke Hippies" framing is just nuts. It's at most a local politics dispute over control over the SF city government. And yet it's spilled over into all kinds of radicalized global thinking. People like pg and Garry are out there on twitter acting like the nutjobs trying to deny their startup workers housing and teach their kids about colonialism as a history paradigm are…

Garry Tan used this murder to flog his political action committee on Twitter. Absolutely disgusting.

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#177

Post by myrmidon »

Varqu wrote: post #49
cemerick wrote: post #2

This news really highlights the confirmation bias that was in full bloom throughout the "discourse" around the initial reports of Lee's murder (e.g. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35448899 ). Everyone is so quick to jump on negative news about the rare violent crime in e.g. SF thanks to feelings about petty property crime that it's obviously impossible to have any kind of fact-based dialogue about policy. Worth…

[flagged]

Why is this downvoted? Are the numbers bad?

This is suprising to me as non-American because Detroit reads to me "like gang-infested murdercity" and I would have expected San Francisco to do significantly better in crime numbers...

Are the numbers misleading or IS criminality in San Francisco comparable to Detroit?

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#179

Post by vkou »

simplotek wrote: post #114
basisword wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The number of high profile tech bros on Twitter using the death to further their own views was disgraceful. SF may have big issues but using someone’s murder to further your political beliefs is horrible. I’m sure we won’t hear any retraction though.

> SF may have big issues but using someone’s murder to further your political beliefs is horrible. What political beliefs are you referring to? The one about SF's crime wave sounds precisely on topic, for example. Edit: those downvotes were very quick.

The piss on the homeless views always get aired whenever a homeless person does something bad, or is accused, without evidence of doing something bad.

It's couched in 'the woke are ruining everything letting murderhobos run rampart' rhetoric. Sometimes with a helping of 'the police are completely unable to function if we subject them to any oversight, or hold them accountable to the rule of law.'

You see this take very frequently on .

Re: Arrest made in SF killing of Bob Lee – alleged killer also worked in tech

#180

Post by idopmstuff »

cemerick wrote: post #172
stickfigure wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It feels a bit like you're championing a narrative of "See, it's not so bad! You'll just get your stuff stolen and your car vandalized!" I wouldn't feel so smug about that. I lived in SF for ~15 years, experienced multiple car breakins (when I had a car) and one weird guy who walked up to me on the street and said "I have a gun and I'm going to shoot you" (which I somehow calmly ignored). For the record, I didn't com…

The only thing I'm "championing" (just pointing out, really) is that certain populations seem to enjoy using anecdotal tragedy to promote their own quasi-apocalyptic worldview re: some American cities, despite all available data contradicting that worldview. I'm sure everyone here appreciates the update on your locale, and your own stories of property crime and/or non-criminal (yet perhaps unnerving?) personal intera…

Someone saying that the have a gun and are going to shoot you is very clearly assault, which is a criminal act. It would generally quality as a violent crime in statistics (if SFPD took reports of threats of violence, which they will not).

While we should use data, we should also understand where there may be issues with the data that we're using.

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