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Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

squareup.com

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Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#171

Post by bombcar »

jedberg wrote: post #163
DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The average Costco shopper makes over $100K a year... While technically true, that statistic is misleading as it requires further qualification, namely that $100k figure only applies to shoppers in Costco's PNW area - not nationwide, and certainly not internationally.

Not sure why you think it PNW only. The number came from the CEO of AMEX, back when they were the exclusive credit card provider for Costco. He said, in 2015, that the average Costco card holder made $100K a year. So presumably that would be in all of the US. More recent attempts at analysis put the number closer to $125K these days for all their customers worldwide. Which makes sense, given inflation and the fact th…

There's a subtle difference between "average Costco shopper" and "average Costco card holder".

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#172

Post by awill »

cwkoss wrote: post #86

Sounds like the real villains are the credit card companies who have the market power to enforce fees on cancelled payments. They are so entrenched no one is even questioning their position anymore. Visa and Mastercard are massive drains on our economy - it's ridiculous how unquestioningly their 3% tax on commerce is accepted.

and yet Apple/Google/Valve can take 30% :)

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#173

Post by arcastroe »

bwy wrote: post #138
unglaublich wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CC companies are genius. They charge companies 3% -> companies embed that 3% in their prices -> customers get a 1% refund from CC companies. - If you do NOT use a CC, you effectively pay _more for CC users_ (3%!). - CC companies make the customer feel like they have a benefit, while in fact, they are net payers too (2%). - They have access to all (private) data of the customer, which is extremely powerful in this age…

You've articulated the exact sentiment that I have to others before. What can we do about it? Is trying to out-lobby i.e. regulate the CC companies the only way? I noticed that other countries don't seem to have this problem.

What prevents a new credit card company coming in and competing with a 2% transaction fee and undercutting visa/square?

Is it barrier to entry? Or would such hypothesized credit card company eventually cave to greed once they got big enough and move to 3% fees?

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#174

Post by patmcc »

cwkoss wrote: post #169
patmcc wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a net economic loss for consumers as a class , sure. That doesn't mean it's a loss for each individual consumer. I'm not against lowering CC fees. But the idea that they're just rent seeking is very silly.

Yeah, I'm aware of "churning". AFAIK its only possible to beat the system by taking advantage of many temporary offers in series and distorting your spending to get the 'free' value offered by their featured partners. i.e. you can only beat the system to the extent that you value airline miles and gift cards as their cash equivalents.

I'm not even talking about churning, though that can be a thing too.

I need to use something for purchases, and each method of payment has pros and cons. Even if using a credit card had a visible 2% additional cost, I'd use it on certain transactions. If I'm dealing with a vendor I might not trust to do a refund, a cc lets me do a chargeback. If I'm concerned about holding large amounts of cash, a cc lets me limit my risk exposure. If I don't have the cash currently, a cc give me an interest-free advance until the statement due date (between 20-40 days in the future).

We can certainly argue about whether those things are worth 1% or 3% or .02%, but they're worth something to consumers.

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#175

Post by brianwawok »

Red_Leaves_Flyy wrote: post #56
AlexandrB wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why sadly? This is basic consumer protection stuff. It seems like currently this fee ends up being paid by the vendor or some middleman, but that seems like BS too. Visa/whoever should be returning the fee and folding it into their business model as the cost of doing business.

Our businesses should be doing more to prevent refunds. The sheer amount of trash every large company makes is sickening.

The sheer amount of stupid reasons a user wants a refund is staggering.

“I didn’t want to use that credit card. Refund and recharge this other card”

Or 500 other silly things

Re: Square to no longer return processing fees when buyers are issued a refund

#176

Post by Red_Leaves_Flyy »

brianwawok wrote: post #175
Red_Leaves_Flyy wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Our businesses should be doing more to prevent refunds. The sheer amount of trash every large company makes is sickening.

The sheer amount of stupid reasons a user wants a refund is staggering. “I didn’t want to use that credit card. Refund and recharge this other card” Or 500 other silly things

Pick your poison. Refund or chargeback and negative WoM.
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