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Why I'll never use Affirm again

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Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#171
OP may not realize how bad the dispute process is with banks.

When a merchant gets a charge disputed, they may not know about the dispute for many days. Then, if the customer lifts the dispute, the banks most often continue to hold the funds, and not release any information to the merchant for 90 days.

It's horrible for merchants and customers.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#172

One point not brought up is that Chase may not be an honest broker here. I've seen both sides of a "charge back" that had the bank lying to both parties while soaking up a bunch of fees. Telling the customer that it had been resolved in the company's favor while telling the company that it had been resolved in the customer's favor. Taking both the funds and fees for themselves. Affirm might well be correct that the b…

Chargebacks don’t work the way people think they work. Under the hood raising a chargeback means your bank send the acquiring bank a message (with an exponent and evidence) that immediately reverts the original transaction and transfers money from the acquirer to the customers bank. The merchant via the acquirer can then issue a message that does the opposite, again with an explanation and evidence. Eventually the ca…

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Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#173
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Extortion?

Indeed. I would just pay it again. 25% of $271 is cheaper than a credit score hit. You can simultaneously dispute with the Attorney General office.

This isn't the worst advice if he has the money to float it.

I recently had a non-renewal on my homeowner's insurance so I had to get new homeowner's insurance. Through a whole bunch of stuff, I wound up effectively sending three payments to two separate insurance companies. I had to float about $7000 - $8000 for a bit.

The insurance agent I had found seemed to be a bit inept, so I wasn't confident they had everything set up properly. Because when I called my mortgage company, they had no clue I was changing insurance companies. They had already submitted payment to the old insurance. I eventually found out how to pay the insurance on my own and just did that. And how to update my insurance information online. Then my escrow paid the new insurance company. So now I had three payments to two companies. And I had to pay into my escrow to cover the double payment. I was prepared to fight both of these companies to get them to cut checks back to me, but just as I was steeling myself for a day of talking to hapless customer service agents, the refund check from the wrong insurance came in. Then a week later, the refund check from the second payment to the correct insurance came in.

But yeah. I wanted to make sure I didn't have a lapse in coverage and then had to cover my escrow shortage. I technically could have waited for everything to sort out, but I didn't want to find out what would happen if things hadn't landed right.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#174
I tried using Affirm once. Apparently the underwriter was "unable to confirm my identity" using my Experian data so I was denied. My credit history is extensive and includes 10+ years of data. So it's not for the lack of credit history. I tried their competitor (Klarna) as well. Their system worked just fine but it was only for $1000. Apparently they have some internal scoring system outside of FICO that helps to determine how much they will loan out. Ended up just foregoing the BNPL process and paying for it directly.

Kind of glad I was denied now.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you pay your balance in full each month every card is 0% forever, at least in the U.K.

This is also true in the US - but not at all what the parent comment meant. If you pay the balance in full every month - you have spent $2000 on a $2000 mattress by the end of the month. This exposes you to ~30 days of inflation and you will have paid no interest. If you pay 0% APR over a twelve month period, and make installment payments until making a single lump sum to close out the line of credit at the end of tw…

Minus the depreciation of using the mattress for a year.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#176
By a very cursory reading, if Affirm sends a negative report to a credit reporting agency, under the Fair Credit Reporting Act, they may be liable for damages and attorney’s fees.

I would suggest writing a letter to Affirm’s legal department describing, very calmly, that Affirm has, apparently knowingly, threatened to send a report to a credit reporting agency despite the fact that Affirm is aware that no actual unpaid debt exists, and that, should this actually occur, you may seek to recover damages under the FCRA.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#177

This is kind of OP's fault, right? I don't think it was appropriate to initiate a charge back on a payment to affirm since they provided their service to OP, that is they already paid for whatever OP was buying. I have a feeling that timing between OP opening the chargeback and the shipping of the item was actually coincidental. I'd think if you paid affirm and the merchant hadn't shipped the item, then your recourse…

Just to add to this, it sounds like OP didn't contact Affirm until after they already started the charge back. I definitely don't think it is appropriate to do a charge back before contacting the vendor that got the payment, which is Affirm.

My credit card won't even let me initiate a chargeback until I've contacted the retailer.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just to add to this, it sounds like OP didn't contact Affirm until after they already started the charge back. I definitely don't think it is appropriate to do a charge back before contacting the vendor that got the payment, which is Affirm.

My credit card won't even let me initiate a chargeback until I've contacted the retailer.

Cards that are higher up in benefits and fees in the US will.

Re: Why I'll never use Affirm again

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bingo. That's why I've done payment plans as well. Not because I couldn't just buy the thing, but because spreading the payments out over 12 months means more investment capital.

> because spreading the payments out over 12 months means more investment capital This is essentially borrowing money to invest. It doesn't matter if the investment makes money or loses money the lender will expect payment. This strategy can make a lot of money, but it's also ruined many people. One key thing to watch while implementing this strategy is your debt to assets ratio. Also understand that during a market…

> This is essentially borrowing money to invest

Yeah, I don't know why more people don't see it this way.

Everyone seems to agree that you shouldn't eagerly make extra mortgage payments to pay off your home loan ASAP. Because you can pay it off over 30 years and presumably make more $$ investing than whatever paltry interest rate you had on your home loan.

But the same people can't explain why it's a bad idea to take out a 2nd mortgage to invest in the market, or even secure a low-interest loan with your home as collateral. But isn't it exactly the same thing?

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