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Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

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Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#171

Post by Dylan16807 »

netizen-936824 wrote: post #123
charcircuit wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sleep and hibernate are about persisting state and not about boot time. I don't want to spend time reopening everything and setting everything up when I come back to my computer. I just want to continue where I left off.

The way I have things set up, my browser opens all my last tabs and I have things set to start the browser and a few other programs at boot. What programs are you using in such a fashion that simply having the program autostart at boot is not feasible?

Debugging has already been mentioned. I run lots of programs that take several hours too, be that copying files or transcoding or processing some data. Right now I have something running that won't be done for two days.

And when I have 20 programs open, even if it only takes 15-30 seconds per program to get them going again that's a bunch of time I didn't need to waste. And even the programs I have that autostart still require prodding to get them into the right state.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#172

Post by Dylan16807 »

raffraffraff wrote: post #170
sowbug wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The task I want to do is quick, and I don't want to spend 30 seconds waiting to start something that might finish in less time than that. A bunch of browser tabs are open, and I don't feel like recovering them at relaunch. I have my app windows set up exactly the way I like them, down to the pixel. I'm used to my phone, TV, microwave, wristwatch, stereo, and car not needing to boot up.

Window tiling has killed off my need to worry about app window position. I used to have a nasty habit of opening a text editor during the day and taking random notes during phone calls or as I worked. Several forced restarts (administrative, accidental or hardware related) forced me to start using those sticky-note apps. I've moved to Joplin now (very structured, supports markdown, syncs to dropbox periodically, is m…

I thought browsers preserved session cookies when configured to open previous tabs on launch.

I don't think I've ever noticed a logout from restarting a browser.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#173

Post by mike_d »

fbkr wrote: post #35
twblalock wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the problem with trying to please power users. There is no monolithic bloc of them. They all want different things. AMD vs Intel? Touchscreens? Strong opinions about screen aspect ratio and resolution, keyboard layout, touchpads, wifi chipset brand, GPU brand, etc.? All there. I wish the company luck, but they are targeting the most picky consumer market there is.

Isn't this supposed to be a strength of framework? Their machines are pretty modular. Users should get to pick and choose AMD vs Intel, keyboard layouts, wifi chipsets without framework having to design different machines for each configuration.

You can only get so modular until you run into the fact that a hybrid Intel/AMD/etc motherboard chipset does not exist. Creating one would cost more money than they have raised.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#174

Post by Abishek_Muthian »

sudders wrote: post #6

Can't wait for framework laptop to run Linux/Ubuntu stable (without battery drain issues) Then I'll be switching all the developers in our company over to a new machine. (Currently running XPS 13, but we are due an upgrade, especially on memory)

> without battery drain issues

Battery drain seems to be a common serious issue among enthusiast linux hardware, e.g. PinePhone, CutiePi and now Framework. Is this a coincidence or is it due to incompatible ACPI on non-standard hardware?

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#175

Post by thom »

freedomben wrote: post #92
qudat wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Running arch with wayland and sway on a framework. Setting up sleep-then-hibernate via systemd works beautifully. I only lose a few % overnight. That’s the thing with running Linux as a desktop, you’ve gotta tweak it to get it just right. Battery life is a non issue for me on the framework. The speakers on the other hand is a brutal downgrade. More thoughts here comparing a 2018 mbp: https://erock.io/2021/11/01/frame…

> That’s the thing with running Linux as a desktop, you’ve gotta tweak it to get it just right. If you're running arch with wayland and sway, then yes absolutely. For people who stick with the default (often Gnome) I haven't had to tweak anything in many years. So I would just s/Linux/customized Linux/ or something like that. Mainly it only matters because some people will be scared away by "you’ve gotta tweak it to…

What distro are you on with hibernate working out of the box (with an encrypted filesystem hopefully)?

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#176

Post by allisdust »

phendrenad2 wrote: post #120
freedomben wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The main reason for this is that the drivers are in the kernel, and Fedora ships new kernels regularly. Ubuntu and many other distros will stay on the same version they initially ship with. For example if they start with 5.14.2 then even a couple years later it will be 5.14.86-200. Fedora tends to ship new major versions of the kernel within weeks of them being released upstream, so you're constantly getting bug fixe…

Linux laptop battery life issues are a constant, right? This has been a problem across laptop brands, across Linux distros, across many, many kernel versions. I just want to temper anyone's false expectations that they can just update from a 1-year-old kernel to one released last week and it'll fix these long-existing issues.

I'm not sure its universal. My laptop loses around 10% battery in sleep with Fedora 35 and I haven't done any configuration changes as such.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#177

Post by pmontra »

aunty_helen wrote: post #9
sudders wrote: post #6

Can't wait for framework laptop to run Linux/Ubuntu stable (without battery drain issues) Then I'll be switching all the developers in our company over to a new machine. (Currently running XPS 13, but we are due an upgrade, especially on memory)

This is a point that people should remember if they're thinking about purchasing a framework. This is still very much beta hardware. The battery drain is annoying, it's around 30-50% per night depending on what addon cards you have. I've got a setup that puts it close to 40% per night so the laptop has to live on charger over night if I want to use it the next day. However, the thing that's really stopping me from us…

I didn't try the Framework but by looking at it my complaint with the touchpad would be that it has no physical buttons. Hard to middle click to paste with Linux. I only buy laptops with 3 buttons and I disable clicking on the touchpad, so the pointer doesn't move when I click. I've got the buttons after all...

Anyway, this is a 13.5" laptop so space is at a premium. I can't expect to include everything. But if they'll build a 15" laptop with NO NUMBERPAD and buttons on the touchpad, I'll consider buying it. I'll pay extras for those buttons and for the numberpad-less keyboard.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#178

Post by vladvasiliu »

cottager2 wrote: post #147
netizen-936824 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way I have things set up, my browser opens all my last tabs and I have things set to start the browser and a few other programs at boot. What programs are you using in such a fashion that simply having the program autostart at boot is not feasible?

I actually find it a bit surprising that you aren’t aware of a difference. Have you used a MacBook recently? If no, I highly suggest you try it. Once you’re used to instant startups, waiting for a boot is just frustrating.

This.

I have an old 2013 MBP that wakes up from sleep quicker than I can open the lid.

This is one of the niceties I've lost when I moved to a PC last year (the others can mostly be attributed to cheap "enterprise" hardware).

My current laptop takes longer to wake from sleep while also sucking the battery dry. Talk about lose-lose.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#179

Post by vladvasiliu »

charcircuit wrote: post #124
netizen-936824 wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The way I have things set up, my browser opens all my last tabs and I have things set to start the browser and a few other programs at boot. What programs are you using in such a fashion that simply having the program autostart at boot is not feasible?

>What programs are you using in such a fashion that simply having the program autostart at boot is not feasible? As a simple example open documents in libreoffice. I don't want to automatically start LO every time I turn on computer. If I have documents open I want to be able to return to the same place when I came back.

Some Linux DEs have a "reopen windows at login" setting. I remember KDE used to have this some 10 years ago, while still on version 3. So if LO is open when you shut down, it'll bring it back up. Otherwise, it won't.

I don't know if it's able to handle reopening the last document, and even less if it can take you back to the position where you left off. This is probably application-dependent.

However, like others here, I would much rather have a functioning sleep that allows the computer to both wake up fast and not drain the battery. I don't really care for it to check my mail while it's in my backpack without any kind of network access, or whatever it is it does instead of sleeping.

Re: Bringing the Framework Laptop to more of the world

#180

Post by deepsun »

sudders wrote: post #6

Can't wait for framework laptop to run Linux/Ubuntu stable (without battery drain issues) Then I'll be switching all the developers in our company over to a new machine. (Currently running XPS 13, but we are due an upgrade, especially on memory)

What is battery drain issue? I have Framework laptop with Linux Mint (Ubuntu inside), and don't see any issues.

If you mean high consumption in "shallow sleep" -- I switched to "deep sleep" in the first day.

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