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Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

blog.libove.org

171–180 of 352 posts

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does the lack of correlation with CPUs verify the GPU correlation?

Correlation can be shown to be causation when all factors are both known and controlled for. Controlling for CPU prices is one step towards that goal.

This is a circular argument. Why are CPU prices a confounding factor?

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#172
post #158

A game theoretically designed paperclip maximizer is growing so large that we're starting to see collateral damage in the broad economy; car prices and availability issues, just to name one example.

Forget car prices, look at overall energy prices this winter.

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The GPU pricing and availability has been a problem well before the current environment. Well before COVID even.

GPU's went up as crypto gained popularity, crypto has gained popularity as governments kept printing more money handouts. We now have high inflation, high demand, chip shortages, supply chain shortages and high crypto popularity because of out of control fiat printing. This also coincides with the governments sudden desire to regulate the industry despite it existing for nearly a decade now. Its a leak in the their s…

While I agree with you that out of control fiat printing is a problem, I think you're overstating things. You can't ignore the role of the pandemic in the supply chain issues, and you can't ignore that many turn to crypto only to gain more fiat. I say this as someone who has been in crypto since 2011, and I've seen what happens during the bear markets. Many who aren't "true believers" or whose bags are too heavy abandon it, even though the money printers haven't changed during those times.

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#174

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If nvidia straight up just stopped selling any cards, declined all their client/customer base, and just put 100% of their global output to mining cryptocurrencies, I think it's a good chance nvidia can do a 50%+1 attack on both bitcoin and ethereum at the same time. Once they successfully do the attack, they can take over the blockchains and allocate all cryptocurrencies to themselves, cash out, and it'd probably reg…

Yeah, they could do that, but what most of these claims ("X could easily profit Y by doing 50%+1 attack") miss, is that once that attack has been made, who'd trade anything with the currency that was attacked? Lets say nvidia does "conquer" Bitcoin and have all the bitcoins, who'd in the right mind would continue to buy/sell Bitcoins after that? The market for Bitcoin would collapse faster than nvidia could excitedly…

I suppose any of the Faang companies could sacrifice a data center for a day or two to do the same. Just crash the currency and get out, to eliminate proof of work currencies.

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#175
post #162
post #72

I work in deep learning and had to camp out in front of a best buy to get my hands on some 3090s. A good portion of the people in line with me were crypto miners who were waiting to get more GPUs to add to their collection because they're making money on each one and as long as it's profitable it makes perfect sense for them to buy up more.

Although AMD may deny it, I suspected this was a reason for their current success, not what they claim publicly...but this study seems to find no correlation (with ether and bitcoin prices) https://www.windowscentral.com/best-gpus-crypto-mining

Not sure what you are trying to say here but that list is weird. Why is 5700xt that great but 5700 not even listed? Not much difference between the two

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#176
post #72

I work in deep learning and had to camp out in front of a best buy to get my hands on some 3090s. A good portion of the people in line with me were crypto miners who were waiting to get more GPUs to add to their collection because they're making money on each one and as long as it's profitable it makes perfect sense for them to buy up more.

If nvidia straight up just stopped selling any cards, declined all their client/customer base, and just put 100% of their global output to mining cryptocurrencies, I think it's a good chance nvidia can do a 50%+1 attack on both bitcoin and ethereum at the same time. Once they successfully do the attack, they can take over the blockchains and allocate all cryptocurrencies to themselves, cash out, and it'd probably reg…

Would this be legal? Obviously bitcoin has no "terms of use" that Nvidia (or anyone) is bound to, but the US has very broad "hacking" laws like CFAA.

I imagine that if Nvidia were to openly "steal" someone's bitcoin using a 51% attack then the victim could sue Nvidia in a US court and things could get interesting.

What laws would apply and what would the outcome of such a case be? And could the act also be considered criminal?

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, they could do that, but what most of these claims ("X could easily profit Y by doing 50%+1 attack") miss, is that once that attack has been made, who'd trade anything with the currency that was attacked? Lets say nvidia does "conquer" Bitcoin and have all the bitcoins, who'd in the right mind would continue to buy/sell Bitcoins after that? The market for Bitcoin would collapse faster than nvidia could excitedly…

I suppose any of the Faang companies could sacrifice a data center for a day or two to do the same. Just crash the currency and get out, to eliminate proof of work currencies.

Again, why would they? They only stand to lose on it, so why do it in the first place?

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If nvidia straight up just stopped selling any cards, declined all their client/customer base, and just put 100% of their global output to mining cryptocurrencies, I think it's a good chance nvidia can do a 50%+1 attack on both bitcoin and ethereum at the same time. Once they successfully do the attack, they can take over the blockchains and allocate all cryptocurrencies to themselves, cash out, and it'd probably reg…

Would this be legal? Obviously bitcoin has no "terms of use" that Nvidia (or anyone) is bound to, but the US has very broad "hacking" laws like CFAA. I imagine that if Nvidia were to openly "steal" someone's bitcoin using a 51% attack then the victim could sue Nvidia in a US court and things could get interesting. What laws would apply and what would the outcome of such a case be? And could the act also be considered…

Stealing is stealing. 51% attack is just a method to rollback a transaction. No different than ordering stuff and doing a willfully fraudulent chargeback.

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#179
post #72

I work in deep learning and had to camp out in front of a best buy to get my hands on some 3090s. A good portion of the people in line with me were crypto miners who were waiting to get more GPUs to add to their collection because they're making money on each one and as long as it's profitable it makes perfect sense for them to buy up more.

If nvidia straight up just stopped selling any cards, declined all their client/customer base, and just put 100% of their global output to mining cryptocurrencies, I think it's a good chance nvidia can do a 50%+1 attack on both bitcoin and ethereum at the same time. Once they successfully do the attack, they can take over the blockchains and allocate all cryptocurrencies to themselves, cash out, and it'd probably reg…

I assume hedge funds are keeping an eye on interesting attacks like this. Short BTC futures, collapse the currency, cover.

Nvidia wouldn't do this because it might hurt GPU sales.

Re: Are cryptocurrencies to blame for high GPU prices?

#180
post #72

I work in deep learning and had to camp out in front of a best buy to get my hands on some 3090s. A good portion of the people in line with me were crypto miners who were waiting to get more GPUs to add to their collection because they're making money on each one and as long as it's profitable it makes perfect sense for them to buy up more.

If nvidia straight up just stopped selling any cards, declined all their client/customer base, and just put 100% of their global output to mining cryptocurrencies, I think it's a good chance nvidia can do a 50%+1 attack on both bitcoin and ethereum at the same time. Once they successfully do the attack, they can take over the blockchains and allocate all cryptocurrencies to themselves, cash out, and it'd probably reg…

I would imagine that compromising the network like that would tank the value of those currencies.
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