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Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

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171–180 of 246 posts

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#171
post #45

Why do people need to meld their ego with some nebulous "classification"? Like yo I'm black. Yo I'm white. Yo I'm asian. In reality, all humans are a continuous spectrum based off of groups of people that evolved in certain conditions over thousands of years. What does a "white" person from Ireland have in common with a "white" person from the Caucuses? What does a "black" person from Sierra Leone have in common with…

Because you're being willfully obtuse of the authors meaning to make a point about semantics. Context and intersectionality (or PIE if you want a more nerdy less loaded term) matters here. White and black have specific meanings, a shared cultural history, and face similar issues and struggles in the US . And there's more to a person than just their "race" despite race being a particularly "loud" (i.e. strong predicto…

Personal attacks and name-calling are not allowed here. They only make things worse. Please make your substantive points without stooping to that.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#172
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because you're being willfully obtuse of the authors meaning to make a point about semantics. Context and intersectionality (or PIE if you want a more nerdy less loaded term) matters here. White and black have specific meanings, a shared cultural history, and face similar issues and struggles in the US . And there's more to a person than just their "race" despite race being a particularly "loud" (i.e. strong predicto…

Such a comment like the one you are responding to comes around like clockwork on HN whenever "black" is mentioned.

That's to be expected from any large, open, anonymous internet forum and is why the site guidelines say this:

"Don't feed egregious comments by replying; flag them instead."

a.k.a. please don't feed the trolls. If people didn't feed it, it wouldn't grow. Therefore the problem is entirely a co-creation.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#173
post #27
post #7

Reminds me of the Pixar movie "Soul" (which is very good)

The barbershop scenes from Soul were one of the things that made me think they were trying to make an authentic, specifically black movie that nevertheless had universal resonance (and they succeeded).

This reminds me how a chauffeur working for Pixar picked up on what they were up to early in production: https://www.npr.org/2021/03/27/981553332/not-my-job-we-quiz-...

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#174

It isn't because they are barbers. That is secondary. These are men's groups. This is men helping other men. Thanks to continued differences re hairstyles barber shops are one of the very few all-male places left in modern society (other than locker rooms which have a distinct competitive air). So it is no surprise that many urban men feel at home and are more willing to talk at the barber than anywhere else.

Barber shops are also full of the most toxic ignorant drivel you can possibly find in the physical world.

This article and the positive comments highlights a need for actual mental health advocates aimed at men.

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#175
I think being able to talk about issues in your life and have an attentive ear is 50% therapy right there. Too many men keep things to themselves for too long.

Once they feel cornered, their only perceived course of action is usually anger and violence in extreme cases.

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#176

A question on the article title from someone who is not aware of the latest words to use w.r.t. race - why is it "Black barbers" but "African American men"? Why aren't both "black" or both "African American"?

Questions like that can be interesting but unfortunately there is no way that a comment like this will lead to interesting responses—just flames from users who, for whatever reason, have other, stronger feelings than curiosity right now. Therefore it's best, as the site guidelines ask, to "Eschew flamebait. Avoid unrelated controversies and generic tangents."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#177

This is really interesting and seems like a great example of how small businesses are better for their community than chains. When I lived in Fort Greene brooklyn I was surprised by how many barbershops and hair salons there were, like 5 or more on the single little triangular block at fulton and greene. It seemed clear they were providing more of a community function than just the utility of getting a haircut that i…

Isn't McDonalds also well known to be a community center?

McDonald's is a place people come with their community. Older folks sit there for hours etc because it's air conditioned/warm. The community doesn't really intersect with the employees though, besides the employees being friendly when the people order.

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By focusing on shared experience of cultural context or upbringing, you're ignoring the shared experience of how people are treated by others. People do have things in common based on skin color. For example, my sister is Filipina. She lives in a white dominated area which has a lot of xenophobia about Mexican immigrants. She has experienced several events where she gets mistaken as Mexican, simply by her skin color…

I agree with what you said. Good comment. My only issue is the level at which that single one-word descriptor is used above all others. So much focus is placed on "black" "white" etc... that it devalues the nuance of other descriptors. Like "immigrant", "rich", "poor", "college-educated" etc.

I believe fundamentally people are ill equipped to deal with this kind of complexity. When labeling people, rather than using a small set of discrete terms, it's closer to a probabilistic clustering problem where each individual is represented by a high dimensional vector where the clusters are generated on the fly and per-use, parameterized by time and space and the observer's viewpoint.

This complex representation is what the area of academia that studies identity has come to call intersectionality. I.e. being black and gay is a particular experience that is also modified by the person's other demographics.

But imagine translating that level of complexity to national discourse (i.e. a CNN article). Doing so leads to two simplifying approaches: one is to attempt to simplify by using broad categorizing terms ('black', 'white', etc); the other is to attempt to reject those terms by not using them. You're describing problems with the first approach. The problems with the second approach are that it can sweep actual experiences under the rug. For example, while 'black' is an incredibly broad term, that is in fact how a large portion of the population labels another large portion of the population, irrespective of their background, which does create a shared black experience that can and should be talked about, but then always at the risk of ignoring other labels that also make sense in context, such as wealth, education, etc.

I don't know a rhetorical way out of this situation. This is why academic texts (by that I mean authors who are attempting to tackle the subject without any undue attempts to simplify) dealing with the subject can become so twisted and hard to read, because actually describing the context of an individual person can lead to a per-person book-level explication of their experiences that also includes a not-insubstantial explication of the author's experiences.

This is a problem with language. Every time I'm personally in a situation that ends up getting written about in the media, a situation where I'm sufficiently involved to understand the nuances of what happened, the article feels like a comic book simplification and reflection of what happened. But then did I experience that event in the same way that other participants did? No. That's the subject matter tackled, for example, in Roshomon. An 'event' in history is a generalization and narrativization of something that will be probably be interpreted very differently by the actual participants involved.

The problem with exercises like what I just wrote is to use the lack of conclusive and easy categorization to justify inaction or disengagement, i.e. "There is no black identity, let's just treat everyone as though they're the same race." That flies in the face of a great deal of lived experience. Especially because a white person in America can afford to act that way, but a black person cannot.

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#179

It isn't because they are barbers. That is secondary. These are men's groups. This is men helping other men. Thanks to continued differences re hairstyles barber shops are one of the very few all-male places left in modern society (other than locker rooms which have a distinct competitive air). So it is no surprise that many urban men feel at home and are more willing to talk at the barber than anywhere else.

Barber shops are also full of the most toxic ignorant drivel you can possibly find in the physical world. This article and the positive comments highlights a need for actual mental health advocates aimed at men.

So they can be trained to think 'correctly'?

Re: Black barbers have become mental health advocates for African American men

#180

This used to be the case for most communities in America, before we decided that externalizing and professionalizing everything was the "economically efficient" solution. If you had a problem, you'd talk to the elder folks in your community and see what they thought about it. Now we barely know our neighbors and our community elders are shipped off to special-purpose holding facilities.

I don't know, the confidentiality of a professional therapist is huge. Plus a lot of the elders I know would advise you to deal with depression by sucking it up. Or try to pray the gay away.
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