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Open source projects should run office hours

simonwillison.net

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Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#171

Post by shoo »

matkoniecz wrote: post #109
nxpnsv wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is about obligations. I feel the developer had a hugely positive experience in inviting interested strangers for 20 minute chats and wanted to spread the positivity. Seems like a nice person, with a nice project, and clearly some extra time available.

I referred specifically to the title in my comment. It is part of things personally irritating to me, and something what is biggest threat to small open source projects that I like. People are mistaken in thinking that having an open source project implies any obligation beyond lack of malice. And people tired by dealing with that are one of top reason why open source projects disappear or are never created.

Rule of thumb when speaking or writing: replace "should" with "could". Simple way to avoid implying obligation.

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#172

Post by simonw »

matkoniecz wrote: post #90

I have deep aversion to "Open source projects should run office hours" title. Maybe "Office hours may be a good idea for open source projects"? This would not suggest obligation. In general, fact that someone created or maintains or supports open source projects should not be considered to create any obligations beyond lack of malice and abuse. I am not obligated to support any bugs, create any features and it is per…

Headline changed to "Open source projects: consider running office hours"

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#173

Post by bombcar »

simonw wrote: post #170
simonw wrote: post #167

Since about half of this thread is (reasonably) taking offense at the implication from the headline that this is yet another demand for free labor from open source maintainers, I'd like to emphasize this sentence: "I’d like to encourage more open source project maintainers to consider doing something similar" It's a matter of fact that many people (myself included) form opinions based on the headline without reading…

I re-titled it "Open source projects: consider running office hours" - if a bunch of different people all misinterpret something the same way that implies poor communication on my part.

@dang - can we get the HN title updated to match this?

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#174

Post by layer8 »

mysterydip wrote: post #156
matkoniecz wrote: post #90

I have deep aversion to "Open source projects should run office hours" title. Maybe "Office hours may be a good idea for open source projects"? This would not suggest obligation. In general, fact that someone created or maintains or supports open source projects should not be considered to create any obligations beyond lack of malice and abuse. I am not obligated to support any bugs, create any features and it is per…

Depending on license, aren't you obligated to provide a repo if you're using the code (ie GPL)? Or do I misunderstand it?

Under GPL-like licenses you are obligated to provide source code if you provide a binary. If you don’t distribute anything, e.g. you only use something privately, then there are effectively no obligations. Of course, if you don’t provide source code for your project (whether legitimately or not), then by definition your project is not open source in the first place.

Note that the GPL specifically does not require publishing the source code, or having to distribute it along with the binaries. It allows the alternative of only providing the source code upon request by any third party, to that same third party.

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#175

Post by [deleted] »

matkoniecz wrote: post #90

I have deep aversion to "Open source projects should run office hours" title. Maybe "Office hours may be a good idea for open source projects"? This would not suggest obligation. In general, fact that someone created or maintains or supports open source projects should not be considered to create any obligations beyond lack of malice and abuse. I am not obligated to support any bugs, create any features and it is per…

[deleted]

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#176

Post by mmq »

I had some good success running similar but not as organized sessions for our open-source project[1] in 2018-2019. There was no specific day of the week and calls were between 30-50 min.

I think this format is much better and more organized, so I highly recommend that open-source maintainers who would like to learn more about how their projects are used to give it a try.

[1]: https://github.com/polyaxon/polyaxon

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#177

Post by hewrin10 »

shoo wrote: post #171
matkoniecz wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I referred specifically to the title in my comment. It is part of things personally irritating to me, and something what is biggest threat to small open source projects that I like. People are mistaken in thinking that having an open source project implies any obligation beyond lack of malice. And people tired by dealing with that are one of top reason why open source projects disappear or are never created.

Rule of thumb when speaking or writing: replace "should" with "could". Simple way to avoid implying obligation.

So we "should" replace "should" with "could"? XD

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#179

Post by PicassoCTs »

matkoniecz wrote: post #109
nxpnsv wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is about obligations. I feel the developer had a hugely positive experience in inviting interested strangers for 20 minute chats and wanted to spread the positivity. Seems like a nice person, with a nice project, and clearly some extra time available.

I referred specifically to the title in my comment. It is part of things personally irritating to me, and something what is biggest threat to small open source projects that I like. People are mistaken in thinking that having an open source project implies any obligation beyond lack of malice. And people tired by dealing with that are one of top reason why open source projects disappear or are never created.

Best thing you haven is not contact information out there what so ever. If you think i owe you something - fork you. Patch is welcome!

Re: Open source projects should run office hours

#180

Post by [deleted] »

bregma wrote: post #153
whizzter wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The title is kinda unclear for someone non-English/US, for me office hours only means the actual hours when things are worked on (rather than any kind of availability time). So skimming the title it quickly I read it as "Open source projects should run on office hours" since my mind filled that in, kinda implied that someone in another part of the world should adjust their life hours to contribute to OSS. (Yes after…

The difference in usage is not localized English: it's cultural student/academic vs. employed. To a student with no professional experience, "office hours" are posted times when a professor is available to further mentor and guide a student. "office hours" are designated times outside of the scheduled class times and professors are generally required to provide them so others can benefit. To a professional and others…

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