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Italian Ruby

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Re: Italian Ruby

#171

Post by [deleted] »

yabai_yatsu wrote: post #155
Pet_Ant wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I dread every time I see Chinese in a codebase (simply because they are a large enough market to split the dev community) They aren't going to split it, the rest of us will adapt. English was arbitrary, so was French and Latin and Greek before it. Probably in the form of some Romaji-like equivalent (ideograms are too high a bar) but we will start to adopt it. The largest economy dictates the lingua franca because t…

>Probably in the form of some Romaji-like equivalent (ideograms are too high a bar) but we will start to adopt it. CCP will make you adopt it as-is, or GTFO. I find it interesting their approach to language compared to Japanese. Modern Japanese borrows so heavily from English, especially if you're doing technical work. Chinese, at the governments request, hasn't done that. Instead new words are coined as needed. They…

[deleted]

Re: Italian Ruby

#172

Post by [deleted] »

xxpor wrote: post #149
tinco wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is that? I don't know about Chinese, but surely Japanese has much better entropy in bytes? As would other languages with more expressive character sets.

That's the issue. English can be represented with 7 bits. Good luck doing that for any logographic language. And that doesn't even take into account that since English (and a lot of alphabet based languages) use spaces to mark where words begin and end. In Japanese, you can have a word that consists of a kanji plus a few hiragana characters as a grammatical marker. But there's no space between that word and the next.…

[deleted]

Re: Italian Ruby

#173

Post by JadeNB »

twic wrote: post #129
roflc0ptic wrote: post #87

There's this absolutely mind bending idea that is - every single function should have a unique identifier. Which is to say: def square(x: Int): Int = x * x should get hashed (and if it has dependencies, they should get hashed in there, too), and your programming language should track the unique identity of this function, and keep a list of names separately from the hashes. This totally solves the localization problem…

So these functions get the same name then: def following_index(i: Int) = i + 1 def item_count_with_free_gift(n: Int) = i + 1

> So these functions get the same name then:

    >  def following_index(i: Int) = i + 1

    >  def item_count_with_free_gift(n: Int) = i + 1
They'd better not get the same name, since one increments its argument and the other one increments an auxiliary variable ….

Re: Italian Ruby

#174

Post by twic »

JadeNB wrote: post #173
twic wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So these functions get the same name then: def following_index(i: Int) = i + 1 def item_count_with_free_gift(n: Int) = i + 1

> So these functions get the same name then: > def following_index(i: Int) = i + 1 > def item_count_with_free_gift(n: Int) = i + 1 They'd better not get the same name, since one increments its argument and the other one increments an auxiliary variable ….

I am very good professional programmer A++++.

Re: Italian Ruby

#175

Post by badsectoracula »

SamBam wrote: post #154
badsectoracula wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was a kid, what the words meant in English didn't matter much (e.g. i was learning Pascal and it took years until i learned what 'procedure' means), they were essentially symbols. They wouldn't really be helpful. I just had a book in my native language which explained things.

I'm not so sure. At that point, why have programming instructions be words at all? Why not make everything a 3-character symbol? While you certainly can learn a programming language without any understanding of the keywords, I don't think you can really say that it doesn't help if you do know them. My kid is learning Scratch, and I didn't have to explain to her what the "REPEAT" block would do.

Words are easier to read and write even if you do not understand their real life meaning, especially since computers are still made with a primary input device for typing words, and allow for way more distinct and readable variations (26 letters + numbers vs just the few symbols on the keyboard). And while they aren't that helpful when learning as a kid, they can still be very helpful later when you have to tackle way more - remember that the argument was about kids learning.

Re: Italian Ruby

#176

Post by martopix »

Kreotiko wrote: post #68
martopix wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Based on what do you say this? I have my browser set to non-geographically specific, and when I ask programming questions to it, there are many, many answers in chinese and japanese. If the programming languages statements themselves were in those languages, a chinese or japanese speaker (in my field) would not need english at all.

From my experience the amount and the quality of resources available in English is simply not comparable with any other language. Surely it is possible without but much harder. I am Italian, during my studies I had the chance to read technical books both translated and in original language. The translation is usually very poor. On a daily basis work scenario, no Italian online resource would come close to stackoverfl…

I am italian as well, and I was specifically talking about chinese and japanese.

Re: Italian Ruby

#177

Post by Pet_Ant »

shados wrote: post #138
Pet_Ant wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I dread every time I see Chinese in a codebase (simply because they are a large enough market to split the dev community) They aren't going to split it, the rest of us will adapt. English was arbitrary, so was French and Latin and Greek before it. Probably in the form of some Romaji-like equivalent (ideograms are too high a bar) but we will start to adopt it. The largest economy dictates the lingua franca because t…

> They aren't going to split it, the rest of us will adapt Yup, but there's no real reason to go from one arbitrary language to another (and I'm saying this as someone who struggles to learn languages, and English was definitely not my first). So it would be a straight set back (overhead of switching), for no real benefit (arbitrary to arbitrary). Another big issue is the split in resources. Right now, anyone can lea…

> So it would be a straight set back (overhead of switching), for no real benefit (arbitrary to arbitrary).

The convenience of the millions of Chinese speakers dwarfs your inconvenience. That is why it will happen.

Already there are plenty of data sheets for electronic components where the English is barebones and there is a lot more Chinese text. Presumably, most of their customers are Chinese and thus their effort goes there. It makes me tempted to learn to read it so I can make use of it... but electronics for me is just a hobby.

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