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Google’s top search result is Google

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Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#171

Post by ksk »

chimen wrote: post #23

Many of them save me extra clicks which is convenient. Google translate, maps and search has no competitors that even come close in terms of quality. I will get mad when those products have better alternatives but it's not the case. Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. One thing that pisses me off is the AMP ordeal bu…

Data based algorithms can only get better when you feed them data. Google makes sure that the data only goes to their own algorithms. Its a chicken and egg situation IMHO.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#172

Post by ksk »

Mirioron wrote: post #170
onion2k wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. You: I wish people would build products that successfully compete with Google. Also you: It's fine if Google do things that stop their competitors successfully competing with Google. This is literally exactly the reason why anti-trust laws exist - to stop a company who are successf…

But if Google search didn't send me to Google maps when I was looking for maps then I would explicitly go to Google maps. In that case there would be no chance for any competitor to do better.

And how does one know that Google even has a maps service to go to? Google maps didn't start out great or even good (Its pretty good now). Google promotes their beta-level products over other mature products to the point the competition is starved of visitors, while Google iterates their own product. So now, after the fact, you can go "Well, there's no one else, I guess Google does the right thing in showing me Google maps as the first result".

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#173

Post by abrowne »

Slartie wrote: post #64
chimen wrote: post #23

Many of them save me extra clicks which is convenient. Google translate, maps and search has no competitors that even come close in terms of quality. I will get mad when those products have better alternatives but it's not the case. Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. One thing that pisses me off is the AMP ordeal bu…

Actually, on text translations, DeepL nowadays outclasses Google Translate IMHO. The only downside is that they don't appear to offer some kind of transparent website translate feature ("put a URL in and it translates the entire site, with layout kept intact"), at least not for free. But if I happen to have a paragraph or so in some foreign language and want that translated to some language I can understand, DeepL ha…

I agree DeepL is often as good or better. (I will sometimes try both and compare. Usually I prefer about half from each, but both are fine on their own.) But DeepL doesn't support nearly as as many languages. Google Translate supports, to pick a few, Basque, Gujarati, Kazakh, Igbo and Thai. Some of those don't have a huge number of speakers, but they also have Arabic, Bengali, Hindi, Indonesian and Swahili, all in the top 20 by number of speakers.

Yes, I know some of these are done through a intermediary (often English, but not always). So if you translate Ukrainian → Catalan it probably really does Ukrainian → Russian → Spanish → Catalan. But it can still be helpful to have the options.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#174

Post by unethical_ban »

Mirioron wrote: post #170
onion2k wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. You: I wish people would build products that successfully compete with Google. Also you: It's fine if Google do things that stop their competitors successfully competing with Google. This is literally exactly the reason why anti-trust laws exist - to stop a company who are successf…

But if Google search didn't send me to Google maps when I was looking for maps then I would explicitly go to Google maps. In that case there would be no chance for any competitor to do better.

Your logic is faulty. You weren't going to go to a competitor from the search page anyway.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#175

Post by hrktb »

gfxgirl wrote: post #153
input_sh wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Momondo, Skyscanner, TripAdvisor, Expedia.

Those are all scammy sights covered in ads and tracking by 30-60 ad companies. I prefer to be tracked by just one and not served ads

It’s a valid point, but also feels like Stockholm Syndrome in a way.

Why not accept our abuser, if they protect us from everyone else also trying to abuse us ?

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#176

Post by iggldiggl »

boogies wrote: post #120
pydry wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found plenty of situations where OSM has better data than Google Maps.

Absolutely, eg. the woods near my house have trails mapped out in OSM that don't exist on Google Maps.

I also find Google's colour scheme rather obnoxious when I want to use the map to actually orient myself (instead of it being merely a convenient geographical background for displaying POIs and route planning) – forests aren't displayed at all once you start zooming in and the distinction between built-up areas and open space (which isn't great to start with) gets more and more indistinct as well.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#177

Post by ehsankia »

onion2k wrote: post #168
chimen wrote: post #23

Many of them save me extra clicks which is convenient. Google translate, maps and search has no competitors that even come close in terms of quality. I will get mad when those products have better alternatives but it's not the case. Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. One thing that pisses me off is the AMP ordeal bu…

Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. You: I wish people would build products that successfully compete with Google. Also you: It's fine if Google do things that stop their competitors successfully competing with Google. This is literally exactly the reason why anti-trust laws exist - to stop a company who are successf…

The word "Compete" here is misleading. It's rather: I wish people would build better products than Google's.

According to you, Google should send users to a strictly worse app, so that it can become better over time? And unless it requires a lot of user data to become a better app, I don't see why it needs traffic from Google to become a better product.

Once it is an arguably better product, then yes, Google should definitely link to it first.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#178

Post by elpool2 »

ksk wrote: post #172
Mirioron wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if Google search didn't send me to Google maps when I was looking for maps then I would explicitly go to Google maps. In that case there would be no chance for any competitor to do better.

And how does one know that Google even has a maps service to go to? Google maps didn't start out great or even good (Its pretty good now). Google promotes their beta-level products over other mature products to the point the competition is starved of visitors, while Google iterates their own product. So now, after the fact, you can go "Well, there's no one else, I guess Google does the right thing in showing me Googl…

It was a while ago, but I remember Google maps being far better than any other map service when it first launched.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#179

Post by dvduval »

chimen wrote: post #23

Many of them save me extra clicks which is convenient. Google translate, maps and search has no competitors that even come close in terms of quality. I will get mad when those products have better alternatives but it's not the case. Build better alternatives and I'm on board. In the end, Google is a business - I would promote my own shit on the first vertical as well. One thing that pisses me off is the AMP ordeal bu…

There are some great translation tools besides Google translate. I find Microsoft translate sometimes outperforms Google translate for certain languages. For example Google doesn't even have Cantonese. And there are some translation apps coming out of China that are also really awesome. I can't speak for other languages. I just wanted to point out that Google putting themselves first in the results is not always an indicator that it is the best results.

Re: Google’s top search result is Google

#180

Post by elpool2 »

chris_f wrote: post #127
fractionalhare wrote: post #27

> A trending search in our data for “myocardial infarction” shows how Google has piled up its products at the top. It returned: - Google’s dictionary definition. - A “people also ask” box that expanded to answer related questions without leaving the search results page. - A “knowledge panel,” which is an abridged encyclopedia entry with various links. - And a “related conditions” carousel leading to various new Googl…

"Is there a way we could get quick curated answers like this without deemphasizing search results?" Yes, here is an example of how it could work: https://www.runnaroo.com/search?term=myocardial+infarction Disclaimer, I made this website.

But this website also deemphasizes search results in favor of curated answers, just like Google.
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