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Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

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Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#171

Post by aendruk »

ViViDboarder wrote: post #86
einpoklum wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a bit difficult to understand what exactly that means. There's Jitsi Meet, Jitsi Desktop, there's a browser extension, a server-which-isn't-just-a-server etc. It's a bit confusing.

I think you’re overstating the complexity a bit. When people mention Zoom I don’t fuss over whether it’s desktop, web (do they even offer it?), mobile, or whatever.

> do they even offer it?

Just to answer this—technically yes, but they use dark patterns to dissuade people from learning about it.

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#172

Post by dang »

robocat wrote: post #92
Novukus wrote: post #49

Guys, guys, it's fine. According to everybody on HN who's so eagerly embraced Zoom and continued to use it even after the security issues, the only thing that matters is that Zoom is the best UX experience for video conferencing. Forget about the human rights, suppression of free speech or the fact that the company is wholly subservient to the CCP (not like anybody could've ever foreseen anything like this ever happe…

I mostly agree with what you are trying to say, but being snarky is against the hn guidelines. Edit: “against” is too strong a word - it isn’t a hard rule but I often see the hn community react negatively to sarcasm and snarkiness even though the content may be worthwhile.

It is a hard rule! https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#173

Post by chrisseaton »

ciarannolan wrote: post #8

I feel like the good faith presumption for this company has to have shifted by now. Is there any reason not to assume that the Chinese government is surveilling Zoom calls en masse? Documenting participants (face, voice, language, location, etc.), recording content, etc. We're talking about the data of 200M+ users. I see people on HN defending Zoom all the time. >The company has acknowledged that much of its product…

> Is there any reason not to assume that the Chinese government is surveilling Zoom calls en masse?

Always assume your calls on the public internet are being surveilled by all parties, no matter which service you're using.

But beside that... if they were surveilling them... why would they close them? Why would you shut down your intelligence source?

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#174

Post by newbie578 »

Seems like even on HN people are walking on eggshells and won't address the elephant in the room.

Very well, I will.

FUCK ZOOM and FUCK CCP.

I am dreaming of a unified world where we boycott China until they change their ways. A man can only dream.

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#176

Post by matwood »

gonehome wrote: post #84
Twixes wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As much as I don't like consolidation of tech, I've had really good experiences with Google Meet. No scummy practices like forcing users to pretend that the app installer doesn't download just to connect from the browser either. What are Zoom's advantages?

I haven't personally used Google Meet, but part of what drew me to Zoom: - General preference for non-ad supported business model. - Google Meet wasn't an option until very recently. - I really dislike hangouts and how it leaks chat all over Gmail (among other things), and this has biased me against their other products. - Similarly, I was a huge fan of Google Voice which was way ahead of its time and which they aban…

> I've anecdotally heard Meet had worse video/audio quality from friends.

The best part of Zoom taking off is suddenly Meet appears to be getting new features almost daily. It's like a product Google suddenly cares about again. Audio and video quality have also greatly improved. It's really like a completely different product from 6 months ago.

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#177

Post by dang »

newbie578 wrote: post #174

Seems like even on HN people are walking on eggshells and won't address the elephant in the room. Very well, I will. FUCK ZOOM and FUCK CCP. I am dreaming of a unified world where we boycott China until they change their ways. A man can only dream.

Would you please stop posting fulminating rhetoric to HN? No doubt your strong feelings are justified but the discussion this leads to is tedious, predictable, and nasty.

The idea here is to have thoughtful comments and curious conversation. "FUCK ONE THING and FUCK OTHER THING" is...not that. Also, can you please not use allcaps for emphasis? maybe it would be a good moment to review the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html.

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#178

Post by [deleted] »

bagacrap wrote: post #150
crazygringo wrote: post #107

I'd just like to see more evidence and information before making judgment here. There's no response from Zoom whatsoever, which is odd. Could this have been other users maliciously reporting the account as abuse, and it was closed automatically? Or something else similar? Or if China is putting pressure on Zoom, then how exactly? If Zoom, an American company, really did intentionally close the account of someone livi…

How is that outrageous? US companies cow tow to CCP all the time, e.g. the NBA. If you're trying not to get blacklisted by the world's second largest market then it makes plenty of sense.

[deleted]

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#179

Post by matwood »

gniv wrote: post #100
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My company tried to use Google Meet. With a group of around 16 people, Google Meet had all sorts of connection quality issues—people's voices cut out while talking, sounded garbled, etc. A week later, we tried Zoom instead. We could hear everyone clearly. We've used Zoom ever since. I had some say in the decision to continue with Zoom, and I feel kind of bad about choosing it, but it's hard to argue with the results.…

> Google Meet had all sorts of connection quality issues When was this? Google Meet has gotten a lot better in the last few weeks.

I made a note above that Zoom getting popular apparently lit a fire under Meet. It's gone from terrible to pretty good in a very short amount of time.

Re: Zoom closes account of U.S.-based Chinese activist after Tiananmen event

#180

Post by Ntrails »

sp332 wrote: post #165
ciarannolan wrote: post #8

I feel like the good faith presumption for this company has to have shifted by now. Is there any reason not to assume that the Chinese government is surveilling Zoom calls en masse? Documenting participants (face, voice, language, location, etc.), recording content, etc. We're talking about the data of 200M+ users. I see people on HN defending Zoom all the time. >The company has acknowledged that much of its product…

> Zoom CEO Eric Yuan said in early June that the company has chosen not to encrypt free calls in order to cooperate with law enforcement. This is incorrect. They don't offer end-to-end encryption, but it is encrypted between each client and the Zoom servers, and they have promised there's no way for a Zoom employee to spy on a conversation without visibly joining the meeting. https://twitter.com/alexstamos/status/126…

Either it is E2E encrypted, or it is unencrypted on zoom servers and the only claim that they can reasonably make is that they haven't provided their employees with the tools to observe a call invisibly.
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