New 13-inch MacBook Pro • Hacker News Board

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#171

Post by bilalq » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:41 PM UTC

Waterluvian wrote: post #59

missosoup wrote: post #2

Is it just me or is Apple starting to fall woefully behind non-mac hardware competitors in both price and perf? I used to look forward to these announcements, now it's just 'we upgraded to a +1 generation config (still 1-2 generations behind what others are doing), that'll be 2000 bucks thanks'. Advertising 4 cores and 2018 Iris graphics as if it's some kind of achievement, when competitors have full dGpu solutions a…

I haven't owned a mac in a while since employment now supplies me with a laptop. But my experience with this point of view is that it's about holistic vs. non-holistic thinking. When someone points at specs and tells me that X is better than Y for price, they're getting to that conclusion by ignoring a whole bunch of variables. To take this to the extreme, I had a friend genuinely say, "Why did you spend $90 on a bab…

I've been feeling a lot more of this jank from MacOS than my other devices at this point. I have a 2017 15" MBPtb and a custom desktop that dualboots Windows 10 and Ubuntu 18.04.

Frustrations I've had to deal with in MacOs that have just not been pain points in other OSes (yeah, not even on Ubuntu):

* No DisplayPort MST support[1]. I spent a large chunk of money on a monitor that had MST so I could daisy chain across two monitors and charge my laptop all with one cable and no separate dock sitting on my desk. I was heartbroken to see that it JustWorks™ on Windows 10 using the MacBook or desktop, but not on MacOS. I ended up needing to buy another expensive dock and sacrifice some desk real estate.

* If you use bluetooth audio headsets, the sound balance randomly shifts to the right if you change volume while the CPU is under load[2].

* No built in window snapping or hotkeys is kind of ridiculous in 2020. Yeah, I have paid for apps like BetterTouchTool and Moom, but it's ridiculous that this is something users have to buy standalone. I often end up assisting coworkers on their machines, and it sucks when they don't have anything setup for snapping.

* Turning WiFI off and back on quickly sometimes results in the second action being ignored. That's such a ridiculous bug to still be there.

At this point, the only killer MacOS exclusive apps I still use are iTerm2 and Homebrew (and I guess XCode out of necessity for iOS/Mac target compilation). If Apple keeps on the trajectory they've been on, I feel like I'll shift away from MacBooks for my next machine.

[1]: https://medium.com/@sebvance/everything-you-need-to-know-abo...

[2]: https://apple.stackexchange.com/questions/280145/macbook-pro...

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#172

Post by Jonnax » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:41 PM UTC

rvz wrote: post #112

lmilcin wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4 cores is actually more than enough to do almost all development. I work on a four core PC right now (i7-4770k) running Linux and couple VMs and containers, one VM dedicated to running Windows 10 which is in turn running Citrix client. I have two 4K monitors and bunch of hardware. I work on webapps, backend software, have couple IDEs running at the same time and probably Zoom session, not to mention huge amount of C…

Yes. Now just avoid running those poor Electron apps which actually impact battery life on all laptops. No user shouldn't need to get a laptop with a i7 CPU with 16GB to 32GB of RAM and a high end GPU to run your over-engineered chat app. I get this all the time with my MacBook that I use for development. Run 1 or 2 of them is fine, but 10 or more at the same time and it will run the machine down to the ground.

Okay. So today most desktop apps are electron.

The advantage is that it allows people to make windows, Mac and Linux apps with ease.

They're not going to go anywhere unless there is a better alternative.

Coding native is a waste of money in most cases. Especially for a chat app.

Hardware manufactures sell computers. The computers they sell need to be able to perform well on the applications that exist today.

There's no point saying the apps are shitty if the laptop they're trying to sell doesn't run well with it.

Maybe today laptops should have 16gb of ram at a minimum.

AMD's resurgence has shown Intel in some cases dropping the price of their CPUs by 50%. Maybe cheaper computers need to be more powerful.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#173

Post by hu3 » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:41 PM UTC

alexggordon wrote: post #125

I was curious how the 13 inch was priced so I compared it to a new Dell XPS 13. Dell has a better processor (maybe, [2]) , but I couldn't find the option to upgrade the Dell to 4TB internal SSD, so I compared both with the 2 TB option. Ram is the same at 32GB. Dell came out to $2399[0] USD and Apple came out to $2999[1] USD. Dell Pros: * Row of function buttons (I've used BTT to customize my touch-bar to the point wh…

I would add form factor in the comparison. Dell XPS 13 is smaller.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#174

Post by ianhowson » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:42 PM UTC

jbverschoor wrote: post #137

ianhowson wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. MacBook Air has quad-core in similar clock ranges but tops out at 16GB of RAM. Pay an extra $1300-ish for Pro, you can get 32GB of RAM. There's literally nothing else in this refresh that's compelling. And the only reason I want that RAM is for Chrome.

Check out: The great suspender.

I use it. I wish I didn't need to.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#175

Post by lotsofpulp » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:42 PM UTC

infecto wrote: post #170

alexggordon wrote: post #125

I was curious how the 13 inch was priced so I compared it to a new Dell XPS 13. Dell has a better processor (maybe, [2]) , but I couldn't find the option to upgrade the Dell to 4TB internal SSD, so I compared both with the 2 TB option. Ram is the same at 32GB. Dell came out to $2399[0] USD and Apple came out to $2999[1] USD. Dell Pros: * Row of function buttons (I've used BTT to customize my touch-bar to the point wh…

I cannot agree more. At least for myself i would add MacOS as a huge plus over any other laptop. I know many people work in Linux but I just for the life of me cannot make it as comfortable as MacOS.

The integration with iOS/iMessages/keychain/homekit /FaceTime is extremely convenient for me. I don't mind paying extra for it, and I like that they have stores near me.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#176

Post by jfkebwjsbx » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:42 PM UTC

ikeboy wrote: post #116

Tenoke wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All OSs have their issues. I use Windows and Ubuntu daily and have had work macbooks. In a lot of cases it does come down to what you are used to, as there are design differences that aren't necessarily worse or better but when you get used to one the other feels janky. At any rate, in Ubuntu's case things like display support are worse - especially multiple different DPI screens (yes, there are workarounds). UI is l…

I've seen this mentioned a few times now on HN as a drawback of Ubuntu. Are multiple monitors really that much of a benefit that so many people use them?

It is an improvement, but not as much as some people claim. The issue is you need to move your eyes/head too much.

If you have a wide or ultra wide monitor, it is better. Otherwise, a good desktop manager with virtual desktops helps a ton.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#177

Post by ashtonkem » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:42 PM UTC

jfkebwjsbx wrote: post #167

ashtonkem wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LP = low power. It gives Apple laptops incredible sleep times, and Apple will take LPDDR3 over DDR4 given that choice.

LPDDR4 (X) is a thing...

IIRC there was some problem with LPDDR4 having issues with sleeping power consumption that slowed Apple’s adoption of it.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#178

Post by jamesrcole » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:42 PM UTC

bluedino wrote: post #12

shawndellysse wrote: post #8

So glad they finally got rid of the butterfly keyboard! That said, I cannot wait until they retire the Touch Bar.

The Air has a perfectly sane keyboard.

I assume you're talking about the latest Air? I have the 2018 model and the keyboard is awful. Awkward to type on and it frequently registers single key presses as double-presses (or, sometimes, no press at all).

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#179

Post by jdlyga » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:42 PM UTC

Does this use the 2020 redesigned keyboard with longer travel? That's literally the only thing I care about that they can potentially change.

Re: New 13-inch MacBook Pro

#180

Post by [deleted] » Mon, May 04, 2020, 1:43 PM UTC

Karupan wrote: post #84

A little disappointed it’s not the rumoured 14” model as I’ve been looking to replace both my 15” and 13” MacBooks. Also, regarding other comments on “just” the 4 core CPU - it’s probably all they could squeeze in without having to redesign the chassis/thermal design. I’m going to hold off for a tear down to see if they have improved the cooling system like they did (Or claimed to) with the 16” version.

[deleted]