Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where? • Hacker News Board

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#171

Post by toast0 » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:44 PM UTC

reilly3000 wrote: post #152

sudosteph wrote: post #56

Native North Carolinian checking in. I'm from Charlotte and I can honestly say that I grew up with more friends who had parents from New York than from NC. A lot of middle class people from upstate NY settled in Charlotte due to the economic opportunities and weather. I'd wager that this migration really started about 30 years ago, and we're seeing the numbers increase even further due to network effects. For example…

Washingtonians (and moreso Idahoans) are particularly irate about Californians moving in, and have been for as long as I can remember. There are a lot of "salt of the earth" types who, regardless of political persuasion, see Californians representing big houses, loose morals, and heavy traffic. The Northwest ethos has been one of eclectic flavors of stoicism, serenity, and a nordic work ethic. Californians, in their…

As one of the Californians moving to the PNW, I've noticed the people who most hate those darn Californians moved from California about 10-15 years ago. I've been here about 18 months, and only run into one guy who has deep roots here and was super grumpy about Californians. I'm sure it varies though depending on exactly where you are.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#172

Post by untog » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:45 PM UTC

formerchamp wrote: post #166

SF and NYC in a nutshell: High taxes to fund entitlement programs like "affordable housing" and the homeless industrious complex, high regulations that only allow mega corps to succeed, landlord unfriendly laws so no chances taken on good borderline tenants, and no firearms for law abiding citizens so criminals are emboldened.

On the flip side: high taxes means access to things like public transportation, meaning that you don't need to own and maintain a car. And crime rates in NYC, at least, are at absolute historic lows. The firearms part of your statement really makes no sense at all.

Some other pluses: a huge concentration of culture, entertainment, dining. Regional transportation hubs to travel to other cities is relatively quick.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#173

Post by RockIslandLine » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:46 PM UTC

sudosteph wrote: post #118

OrangeMango wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Illinois has high taxes and terrible weather Illinois has a flat income tax; at $135k income you would only be beat by the states that have no income tax (like Florida). Most of the states on that list also have weather that is either terrible in the summer or terrible in the winter, so I doubt that weather is really a factor in people moving.

I had a talk recently with someone who moved from Chicago to Atlanta. He said it's the property taxes that really kill you there. Allegedly, by moving to GA he decreased his property taxes enough to put an extra 100k towards the mortgage for the same monthly payment. I don't know the hard numbers on that myself, but it was enough to convince me that buying property in Chicago was probably a bad idea.

It's not hard to get that data. The tax rates are public knowledge.

Cook county has just over a 2% per year property tax.

https://www.cookcountyclerk.com/sites/default/files/pdfs/201...

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#174

Post by davidw » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:46 PM UTC

harimau777 wrote: post #156

davidw wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's reasonable that you don't get an actual nuclear waste facility next door, but people in California have gone so far beyond any kind of "reasonable". Exhibit 239839229: https://www.citylab.com/equity/2018/10/san-jose-trying-build... - people getting bent out of shape about housing for teachers , FFS!

It's not clear to me from that article: Did the plan that they were opposing provide any assurances that the houses built would be good quality? The people quoted state that their concern is that overcrowded or low quality public housing[1] would be built. If the law addresses their stated concerns and they still oppose it then I think that it's fair to criticize them. However, I don't think it's fair to just assume…

> "we don't want anyone who isn't upper middle class"

This is precisely what it is. They're teachers, for crying out loud.

The US hasn't really done 'giant tower block' public housing for decades. That's just scare tactics.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#175

Post by mdavidn » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:46 PM UTC

CamperBob2 wrote: post #101

jamisteven wrote: post #67

Californians arent all moving just due to housing costs, overall cost of living there is pretty nuts and unless you work in big tech, your salary is not that great. State plus federal income tax alone was a deal breaker for me when I was there.

State plus federal income tax alone was a deal breaker for me when I was there. Especially now that state income tax is no longer Federally deductible. I've found it very surprising that people on both the pro-tax and anti-tax sides don't make a bigger stink about that.

That and property tax on high-value housing is basically no longer deductible either.

I think Republicans backed this plan hoping it would create pressure to decrease taxes in blue states. Instead, the double taxation has only incensed taxpayers like me.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#176

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:47 PM UTC

vondur wrote: post #84

sharkmerry wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crime has ticked up slightly compared to the lows, but it has comparable rates to the 60s right now. Before the explosion of crime in the 70s and 80s

Many people aren’t bothering to report crimes now. The police won’t do anything about it. You can pretty much get away will minor property crimes/theft now without any repercussions.

[deleted]

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#177

Post by jayd16 » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:47 PM UTC

weiming wrote: post #148

highdesertmuse wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious question:do you still vote Democrat?

Tongue-in-cheek comment that I've read somewhere is that folks flee Democrat-run cities due to high taxes and mismanagement and move elsewhere, but then continue voting Democrat to bring back the same policies they wanted to escape from.

Or, you know, they just want to move to a smaller city. Houston's still a third as dense as LA, NY or Chicago so its not like politics are the only differences.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#178

Post by smsm42 » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:49 PM UTC

dfsegoat wrote: post #4

Sonoma County, CA here. We've lost more people from our county than any other in the state between 2017-2018 [1], and it is only continuing. From the few of these people I have spoken with - anecdotally: - None left because of the fire risk, specifically. [though some obviously did - 2] - Most left because of the cost of living: $600k avg home price. - Some also left because of political and human environment: We hav…

> Petty crime is increasing, and state laws are only enabling this - people are sick of it.

I wonder if people considered voting the politicians who made these laws out. Judging from CA voting patterns, probably not. And then when it gets really bad, they move to another state and likely vote for the same policies that caused them to move in the first place.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#179

Post by chiph » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:50 PM UTC

If you want to explore this exodus yourself, one of the things you can do is use the uhaul.com website. They have dynamic pricing based on availability and demand. At the current time, renting a 26' truck to move one-way from Mountain View CA to Dallas TX will cost you $4,230. But driving the opposite direction will only cost you $846.

Re: Goodbye, New York, California and Illinois – Hello where?

#180

Post by reaperducer » Fri, Jan 17, 2020, 10:51 PM UTC

highdesertmuse wrote: post #120

enad wrote: post #79

I grew up in Central California and then lived in the Bay Area from 2001 until 2010. Had kids, and a online job, so we next moved to the Sierra Nevada foothills, where we lived for a decade. We moved to a suburb of Houston, Texas about a year ago. Best decision ever. In a nutshell: Overall, quality of life has gone way up. Taxes have gone down. Wages have gone up. Everything is cheaper, which means we all get to do m…

Serious question:do you still vote Democrat?

Serious question:do you still vote Democrat?

He said "Houston," so chances are the answer is yes.

People outside of Texas like to pretend that it's a solid red state. They conveniently don't bother to look at electoral maps and pretend that Austin doesn't exist so long as they can make jokes about where someone else lives.