I started working on electric cars way before Tzero helped create Tesla Roadster. Wasted my young ages trying to explain the benefits of EV and died with no support at all. Next year Tesla turned into a billion dollar company. Our fault? Being located on Europe, instead on USA. And yes, Rimac uses our tech on their power trains. 14 years later.
The electric car as a talisman of false hope
171–180 of 338 posts
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#172Two me, reading the graph in the article brings up two priorities: 1: transition to renewable energy 2: figure out how to lower the carbon emissions during 1&2 sound a lot easier than completely transitioning off motorized personal transportation. #2 can be done with appropriate government incentives, like a $100/ton carbon tax + equivalent tariff. Producers will use alternate energy sources and otherwise eliminate c…
Oops, "2: figure out how to lower the carbon emissions during vehicle production"
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
They don't make a real difference, and the author is correct about it. If you drive towards a wall and you're accelerating and all you're doing is slowing the rate of acceleration you're still going to run into the wall at terminal velocity. The author correctly points out that the total increase in car usage, mostly conventional engines is going to offset the small dent that electric cars make, and that cars themsel…
The real problem, as the author tangentially points out, is our over-reliance on cars to move us around. That’s due to the intentional choices that we have all made. If you look at the structure of suburban areas of cities in the US, you’ll immediately see that they are entirely designed the assumption of the existence of a personal car for YOU. You simply cannot get around without one. A choice that I’m grappling wi…
>A choice that I’m grappling with personally (as someone who lives in the suburbs in the US and owns two Teslas) is that I should really move somewhere more sustainable, i.e., more density so that I can get rid of my cars. That’s more difficult given family needs etc. If I didn’t have to factor others’ needs, I would have done this already.
This is exactly what I'm planning to do. However, for most Americans, it isn't a realistic choice, because it means you have to emigrate from America. There's almost no place in this country where you can live without a car.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#174His argument distills to: solve it all-at-once, or don’t solve it at all. This is an uninteresting and uninspiring line of thinking that ignores the nature of socially dynamic systems which don’t exist in a world of instantaneous cause-and-effect. His conclusion states that electric cars make a difference, but they don’t make a real difference: “I do think they can slightly reduce unsustainability” but “by switching…
The really irritating thing about the 'solve it all at once' argument is that electric cars, in a very real way, are the keystone that lets the entire arch support itself. Renewable energy sources are already the cheapest ways of generating electricity at certain times, the trouble is that those aren't always when the electricity is needed. Energy storage makes investment in renewables much more profitable. The problem is, energy storage is itself expensive, much too expensive to invest in for most situations.
By attaching wheels and motors, electric cars make people pay more for batteries than they ever would otherwise be willing to spend on energy storage.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#175His argument distills to: solve it all-at-once, or don’t solve it at all. This is an uninteresting and uninspiring line of thinking that ignores the nature of socially dynamic systems which don’t exist in a world of instantaneous cause-and-effect. His conclusion states that electric cars make a difference, but they don’t make a real difference: “I do think they can slightly reduce unsustainability” but “by switching…
They don't make a real difference, and the author is correct about it. If you drive towards a wall and you're accelerating and all you're doing is slowing the rate of acceleration you're still going to run into the wall at terminal velocity. The author correctly points out that the total increase in car usage, mostly conventional engines is going to offset the small dent that electric cars make, and that cars themsel…
> The author correctly points out that the total increase in car usage, mostly conventional engines is going to offset the small dent that electric cars make,
That (almost-certainly-incorrectly) assumes that conventional engines will continue to grow in use forever despite electric vehicles continuing to decrease in price and increase in performance/versatility/diversity. At some point we'll see an inflection point, especially as charging stations continue to proliferate.
That is: just because electric cars ain't dominant marketshare-wise now doesn't mean they'll never be.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#176Seems to me a lot of people are so attached to carculture that they can't even read the article properly. The author sees all sorts of good things about electric cars. I drive them myself. I love cars. But... The points the article makes about cars being part of a larger flawed system of urban and rural development are spot on. 'Self-driving' cars will only make this worse. Even just the excessive prevalence of hard-…
I've been thinking about this for awhile and I think the problem is roads. People will go wherever the roads are good. They will build houses everywhere and subdivide everything a million times. However, if there is no way to access a certain area or it is very difficult, they will not go there and build.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#177Earlier quoted context omitted.
Someone should go through the comments and collect together all the "perfect" solutions. If we let the "ban cars" and the "ban children" folk fight it out then that frees up time for the "pragmatically improve things along many different dimensions, many of which would be beneficial even if we totally ignored climate change" folk to get on with things.
You can deny it all you like, but it’s true [1] and you’re just illustrating the point: nobody wants to do the things that actually matter , because those things are painful (not incidentally, #2 is “sell your car”). It’s far easier to mock the people who tell you the truth than it is to make substantial changes. [1] https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment...
Or those things will just scare people into doing nothing because it's so overwhelming and hopeless to be so uncompromisingly perfectionist about it.
Whereas making a car or a plane trip or a burger or a child x% more expensive will move us in the right direction and even that will be resisted to a crazy degree.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#178Earlier quoted context omitted.
Someone should go through the comments and collect together all the "perfect" solutions. If we let the "ban cars" and the "ban children" folk fight it out then that frees up time for the "pragmatically improve things along many different dimensions, many of which would be beneficial even if we totally ignored climate change" folk to get on with things.
You can deny it all you like, but it’s true [1] and you’re just illustrating the point: nobody wants to do the things that actually matter , because those things are painful (not incidentally, #2 is “sell your car”). It’s far easier to mock the people who tell you the truth than it is to make substantial changes. [1] https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/environment...
You know what would be EVEN more effective at fighting climate change than not having children? Committing suicide.
But people don't want to listen to the harsh truths. They would rather consume their way out of the problem with electric cars, education for third world countries, reforestation, solar power and other false hopes.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#179Earlier quoted context omitted.
Mr. Money Mustache is a financial blogger, he emphasizes minimal living and reducing environmental footprint. He calls cars 2 ton wheelchairs and advocates MUCH more bicycle use. I have to say I agree, we need to cure our ridiculous car habits, especially 1) buying ridiculously huge vehicles with terrible MPG; 2) taking short trips everywhere in the car, when walking or biking would do. https://www.mrmoneymustache.co…
Bicycles are great, but there is no reason all cars need to weigh two tons or have room for 5-7 passengers.
Actually, there is: if you get in a collision with a large vehicle in a really tiny one, you're going to die. So you need a larger vehicle that can make a crash survivable. Basically, it's an arms race.
Re: The electric car as a talisman of false hope
#180Earlier quoted context omitted.
Exhaust emissions are only part of the air pollution problem - brake discs and tyres contribute around 50%, as I recall. Depressing! But we need lighter vehicles all round, and less travelling in general.
>brake discs Regenerative braking does not have this problem. Although the tyre problem remain.
Tires are a far more significant pollution source than brakes.