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Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

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Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#171

Post by tragicpapercut »

dalbasal wrote: post #45
bad_user wrote: post #5

In the case of Chrome, you can't blame Google. They made a good browser, did some marketing and it got popular. However the current situation is worrisome, because alternative implementations are dying and in the case of the web, diversity is important. Both Opera and Microsoft's Edge are now powered by Chromium. Chromium is a project controlled by Google. Its redeeming quality, in terms of its open source nature, is…

" They made a good browser, did some marketing and it got popular. " They did make a good browser. However, their market share is not down to better browser or "some advertising." They use their other assets (search, youtube, android, docs..) to make chrome the "default" option. It's a dominance breeds dominance cycle... a hallmark of modern monopoly. Chrome wouldn't have gotten anywhere if it wasn't a very good brow…

My personal experience is not what you are advertising here. I like Chrome because of the features unrelated to performance on Google's own assets - it simply has been the better browser. Yubikey support. Enterprise management capabilities. A robust extension ecosystem. Security. Better memory management for multiple tabs. Some of these are no longer a differentiator for Chrome, but Chrome got there first.

Firefox, IE, Opera have all been way late to the game on some or all of these features.

In the past I have been in the position to help make decisions on browser support at my company. We easily decided on Chrome because it was faster and more secure than IE, but more manageable than Firefox at an Enterprise level. Firefox is just starting to catch up to these feature sets. IE gave up. Safari is a literal running joke even amongst the most ardent of MacOS supporters at my company - features are simply non comparable.

I never once saw an incompatibility problem in Firefox that made me open Chrome. I currently run 2 browser sessions on my main computer - one in Firefox for personal use and one in Chrome for work use. I like and use Firefox, but Chrome has momentum.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#172

Post by Andrex »

noname120 wrote: post #52
bad_user wrote: post #5

In the case of Chrome, you can't blame Google. They made a good browser, did some marketing and it got popular. However the current situation is worrisome, because alternative implementations are dying and in the case of the web, diversity is important. Both Opera and Microsoft's Edge are now powered by Chromium. Chromium is a project controlled by Google. Its redeeming quality, in terms of its open source nature, is…

> competitors such as Microsoft proved that they no longer have the capacity to develop a modern browser This is incorrect. They absolutely can as demonstrated by the fact that former Edge works great, has better hardware acceleration than Chrome, and consumes less power. However, they are not willing to anymore, which is a huge concern for future innovations in that domain.

It is correct, but it hinges on your interpretation of the phrase "modern browser." Edge was falling behind on implementing the web spec compared to Chrome (among other things.)

> This is incorrect. They absolutely can as demonstrated by the fact that former Edge works great, has better hardware acceleration than Chrome, and consumes less power.

If Edge had all those things but could only render HTML4 and below, would it be considered a "modern browser" still? I would say no. That's an extreme hypothetical but it was similar to the future Microsoft saw for Edge, and a major factor in the switch to Chromium.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#173

Post by lunchables »

bad_user wrote: post #5

In the case of Chrome, you can't blame Google. They made a good browser, did some marketing and it got popular. However the current situation is worrisome, because alternative implementations are dying and in the case of the web, diversity is important. Both Opera and Microsoft's Edge are now powered by Chromium. Chromium is a project controlled by Google. Its redeeming quality, in terms of its open source nature, is…

>I think nowadays Firefox is a much better browser and that Mozilla is better at guarding my interests, so I would use Firefox even if it weren't a better browser, however the market isn't necessarily interested in that.

Agreed. Firefox is really fast, and I love it. Been using it for a couple years now. But even if Chrome was demonstrably, objectively faster, I would still use Firefox.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#174

Post by holtalanm »

bad_user wrote: post #5

In the case of Chrome, you can't blame Google. They made a good browser, did some marketing and it got popular. However the current situation is worrisome, because alternative implementations are dying and in the case of the web, diversity is important. Both Opera and Microsoft's Edge are now powered by Chromium. Chromium is a project controlled by Google. Its redeeming quality, in terms of its open source nature, is…

i tried firefox, and loved the experience, but ran into a few minor bugs related to css that just made absolutely no sense.

also, it regularly ran my cpu at max throttle when doing anything video-related within the browser (watching netflix, on a video chat, etc), while chrome is much more cpu-friendly with those things (don't know why that is).

I tried Opera, as well, and ran it as my main browser for months (almost a year, actually), but there is a wierd bug in windows related to the browser bar expanding when the machine wakes up from sleep, where the only way to fix it is to restart the browser entirely.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#175

Post by efdee »

dalbasal wrote: post #106
wguaa wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Chrome wouldn't have gotten anywhere if it wasn't a very good browser. It is good. It is not only good. When it came out it wiped the floor with the alternatives. Firefox 3, from that time, was absolutely pathetic in terms of performance. I remember sticking to 2 for a while. Even today Chrome is still the best, even if the margin has narrowed. Other browsers are having to adopt Blink to catch up.

Idk about wiped the floor, but it gets subjective. Immediately before chrome launched, FF was slowly eating into IE's market share. Chrome was good, but so was FF. I don't think chrome ever had a lead in FF anything like the lead FF had over IE. Mozilla always had to play with a disadvantage. Still do.

Anecdotal but I switched to Chrome when it came out because it's JS engine was (or at least felt) massively faster than Firefox's.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#176

Post by holtalanm »

huy-nguyen wrote: post #163
lprd wrote: post #75

I installed Firefox as my daily driver last year and have been completely happy with it. Great dev tools, good performance, and I agree with Mozilla's stance on privacy. All wins for me. I'll still occasionally open up Chrome for dev purposes -- but for the sake of browser diversity and maintaining an open internet, I encourage all my friends to give Firefox a try.

The main problem with Firefox is high memory usage.

i had a opposite experience. memory usage was great in firefox, but it pegged my CPU.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#177

Post by falcolas »

SmellyGeekBoy wrote: post #161
danielnesbitt wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That does not happen because you searched for Firefox. A dismissible popup suggesting you 'Switch to Chrome' appears if using IE to search with Google regardless of your search term. It seems Microsoft is bit more egregious in Bing. If you search for Chrome or Firefox you get "Promoted by Microsoft - Microsoft Edge is the recommended browser for Windows 10 and it’s already installed on your PC."

...and if you change your default browser to anything else, you'll get endless "Try Edge!" messages in your notifications and even on your lock screen.

Microsoft's bad behavior does not excuse Google's bad behavior.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#178

Post by efdee »

stephenr wrote: post #35
bad_user wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've seen dark patterns from Google, but in the case of Chrome I have a hard time remembering any. Do you mean that they advertised for Chrome on their properties? Advertising on your own property is legitimate in my book. And simple advertising isn't a "dark pattern". Or do you mean something else?

A big "works better in Chrome" button/banner is not legitimate advertising.

But it's the only way we marketed browsers back in '95!

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#179

Post by _r_o_y_ »

tragicpapercut wrote: post #171
dalbasal wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" They made a good browser, did some marketing and it got popular. " They did make a good browser. However, their market share is not down to better browser or "some advertising." They use their other assets (search, youtube, android, docs..) to make chrome the "default" option. It's a dominance breeds dominance cycle... a hallmark of modern monopoly. Chrome wouldn't have gotten anywhere if it wasn't a very good brow…

My personal experience is not what you are advertising here. I like Chrome because of the features unrelated to performance on Google's own assets - it simply has been the better browser. Yubikey support. Enterprise management capabilities. A robust extension ecosystem. Security. Better memory management for multiple tabs. Some of these are no longer a differentiator for Chrome, but Chrome got there first. Firefox, I…

Open Google or Youtube in Edge an you'll see a huge banner advertising Chrome. That use to happen for practically every other browser.

Re: Google’s Chrome Becomes Web ‘Gatekeeper’ and Rivals Complain

#180

Post by PointersAreFun »

AznHisoka wrote: post #115
dalbasal wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Idk about wiped the floor, but it gets subjective. Immediately before chrome launched, FF was slowly eating into IE's market share. Chrome was good, but so was FF. I don't think chrome ever had a lead in FF anything like the lead FF had over IE. Mozilla always had to play with a disadvantage. Still do.

Was it Chrome that came up with tabs? i cant seem to remember if FF had it. If FF didnt have tabs, that is enough for me to say Chrome wiped out the competition.

Tabs were around for at least 10 years before the first release of Chrome
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