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Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

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Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#171

Post by dogma1138 »

rootusrootus wrote: post #169
dogma1138 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And do you think the bondsmen don’t have an incentive to keep the status quo? It’s a multi billion dollar industry which effectively taxes the poor. Make bounties illegal and it fill fall, once it falls the entire bail system in the US will have to be rethought as there isn’t a way to lock so many people up, more judges will release them until trial without setting a bail which they can already legally do and do so f…

Bounty hunters are not universal. For example, here in Oregon they are illegal.

There is also no private bail in Oregon afaik, but I think only 5 states or so are like that.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#172

Post by dogma1138 »

zorga wrote: post #152
dogma1138 wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And do you think the bondsmen don’t have an incentive to keep the status quo? It’s a multi billion dollar industry which effectively taxes the poor. Make bounties illegal and it fill fall, once it falls the entire bail system in the US will have to be rethought as there isn’t a way to lock so many people up, more judges will release them until trial without setting a bail which they can already legally do and do so f…

You're putting the cart before the horse; until you change the government and thus the bail system, we need bondsman. Making bounties illegal won't stop judges from setting bails people can't afford and is thus not a valid solution.

There are several states with no private bail including Oregon and Massachusetts somehow I doubt that offenders in those states are worse off.

In a country where judges are elected a multi billion dollar has a lot of power in determining how bail is set by the courts.

If you think that judges that get donations from bondsmen don’t take that into account when setting bail you are very naive.

This is the exact same problem as private prisons the justice system should not be monetized for profit.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#173

Post by geekamongus »

jopsen wrote: post #122
closeparen wrote: post #77

Criminal investigations have to stand up to court scrutiny. Fugitive recoveries do not. I expect there’s a lot more misconduct where this came from.

The whole bounty hunter system sounds like something out of a bad movie.. I would be very surprised if it wasn't full of abuse stories.

Considering they tend to have names like "Dog" and "Bossk" I would agree.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#174

Post by Spooky23 »

cc439 wrote: post #113
Spooky23 wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that’s a scummy business known for not following the letter of the law.

It's a scummy business but without it bail bonds wouldn't exist, or at least be as widely available as they are today. Maybe there are better systems for ensuring compliance with orders to appesr in court than that of Bail but as long as the concept of Bail exists, private Bail Bonds will have to be a necessary part of the system lest lower/no-income individuals find themselves with no recourse.

Excessive bail is why you have bail bonds.

There are myriad ways to ensure compliance, nearly all of which would be better than enabling a privatized, unaccountable para-police force.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#175

Post by Semaphor »

User23 wrote: post #123
dogma1138 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about we start with not allowing people to legally kidnap individuals? I never understood the whole concept of “bounty hunters” in the US it’s not the Wild West anymore. The problem here is that “fugitive recovery” doesn’t need to meet any of the standards normal law enforcement does and unless they kill someone or injure bystanders there likely won’t be an investigation into their conduct and even if there is on…

The vast majority of bounty hunting cases are going to the addict/drunk’s door and reminding him he’s got a hearing to be at. The kind of glorifications you see on the teevee are virtually nonexistent. As for the privacy aspect, well online privacy is observably a fiction and it always has been. Only naifs and fools believe otherwise in the face of overwhelming evidence. Sure there ought to be privacy online in some…

There are one or two bounty hunters live streaming their job at twitch. The vast majority of their job is sitting in a car, driving. But it usually doesn't seem to involve showing up at an "addict/drunk’s door"

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#176

Post by jonahhorowitz »

craftyguy wrote: post #144
chii wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would your tune change if by not agreeing to sell your own data, the service charges you money?

> the service charges you money They (mobile carriers) already do charge me money... What's your point?

Exactly this. I’m already paying them. I’d be open to a “won’t sell your data” surcharge, but I doubt that would last long due to the political implications.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#177

Post by jijji »

dogma1138 wrote: post #109
40acres wrote: post #56

I think we need to reassess how we treat data generated by users via phones, devices and our digital activities. We had the concept of private and public property long before intellectual property became codified by law. I believe that we are entering a new phase which may require the development of a new type of jurisprudence around things like location data. I'm definitely not a lawyer, but I'm starting to believe…

How about we start with not allowing people to legally kidnap individuals? I never understood the whole concept of “bounty hunters” in the US it’s not the Wild West anymore. The problem here is that “fugitive recovery” doesn’t need to meet any of the standards normal law enforcement does and unless they kill someone or injure bystanders there likely won’t be an investigation into their conduct and even if there is on…

making a citizens arrest is not the same as kidnapping... anyone can make a citizens arrest if a crime is being committed, this is perfectly legal. Kidnapping is when you detain someone who has not committed a crime.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#178

Post by kokokokoko »

coldtea wrote: post #130
kokokokoko wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who has worked with a couple data aggregation startups, I find it surprising I am unaware of the laws that classify it as private info(or even the legal definition of what "private info" is). With that said, I am certainly not a lawyer and was never directly involved. Which particular laws are you referring to? Edit: I should mention I am aware of laws preventing the collection of certain types of data. Bu…

> As someone who has worked with a couple data aggregation startups, I find it surprising I am unaware of the laws that classify it as private info(or even the legal definition of what "private info" is). As a European, I wasn't saying that you have laws that classify it as "private info". I'm saying that you _should_ have (or get) some such laws. Including laws about the "possession of that data" -- GDPR for example…

Ah, my apologies. I misunderstood that and thank you for clarifying. I absolutely agree. I hope we, in the US, come to a point where we treat personal info in a similar way. Best regards from across the pond.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#179

Post by learc83 »

zorga wrote: post #146
dogma1138 wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The majority of bail isn’t prescribed at the federal level plenty of states can go way with it if they wanted too. The whole concept of bail shouldn’t have a place in a modern society.

No one said anything about the federal government; state governments are just as absurd and just as divided.

The majority of states are completely controlled by one party (the majority of the legislature and the governor are belong to the same party), and only one state has a split legislature.

Re: Mobile customer location data is ending up in the hands of bounty hunters

#180

Post by learc83 »

closeparen wrote: post #132
jopsen wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole bounty hunter system sounds like something out of a bad movie.. I would be very surprised if it wasn't full of abuse stories.

Professional law enforcement agencies are a recent development historically, and for a long time were resisted as something out of an authoritarian dystopia. Policing was the job of amateurs and freelancers for much longer than it’s been a civil service bureaucracy. Even death investigation was, until recently, a side gig for the town doctor.

Yep, and there are good reasons that policing was put into the hands of professional agencies.

London's self-proclaimed "Thief-Taker General" is a good example. A gang leader who made money through both committing and "solving" crime.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Wild

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