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Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

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Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#171

Post by sp527 »

navinsylvester wrote: post #150
romeisendcoming wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are shit programmers. Complexity != talent.

Most gifted talent in my experience exhibit these negative traits which impact productivity. If you have a counter point based on your experience - would love to hear that.

I think his point is that truly intelligent people would know better than to do this because it requires more holistic thinking (i.e. accounting for the reality of other people). The person you’re describing may be intelligent in some ways, but not enough to zoom out and understand the bigger picture.

Elon Musk is another good example. Someone who is so much a victim of his behavioral impulses and savior complex that he’s a catastrophically negligent leader, as recounted by Tesla employees in a recent story.

I’m of the opinion that you’re not truly intelligent if you are unable to recognize and correct for your own character flaws.

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#172

Post by SimonPStevens »

ryandrake wrote: post #166
rotten wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Life gets in the way for a while: Kids. Spouse/partner. House. Hobbies. Cynicism. Burnout. Health. Elder care. Then things settle. You work through the life thing, and in your 50's you get a fresh perspective and new energy.

All of the above, plus, at most (non-FAANG) tech companies, as an individual contributor your salary will plateau when you’re around 30-35. During your 20s you’ll get used to double digit pay raises and then all of a sudden that will stop. Even changing jobs won’t give you more than a 1-2% bump as some point. I’ve had that surreal “we really want you to stay but we can’t give you a raise” conversation too many times…

Yes, this. So then those young brilliant individuals move into management because it's the only way to continue some semblance of career progression in your 30s.

Then a subset of the gifted technical individuals grow tired of management, step down and go back to the tech to do what they really loved all along.

I've met a fair amount of brilliant engineers in their 40s/50s who have been through management and decided it's not for them and are now shining as engineers again after a decade lost to leadership roles

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#174

Post by navinsylvester »

sp527 wrote: post #171
navinsylvester wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most gifted talent in my experience exhibit these negative traits which impact productivity. If you have a counter point based on your experience - would love to hear that.

I think his point is that truly intelligent people would know better than to do this because it requires more holistic thinking (i.e. accounting for the reality of other people). The person you’re describing may be intelligent in some ways, but not enough to zoom out and understand the bigger picture. Elon Musk is another good example. Someone who is so much a victim of his behavioral impulses and savior complex that…

That is the subtle point i was trying to make. In most cases talented young people are easily noticed and usually given more credit than due without measuring the overall contribution to productivity.

Eventually most with the tag will mellow down with experience. But when that switch slowly happens - many would hardly notice anything but a seasoned bankable asset.

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#175

Post by oldmancoyote »

minipci1321 wrote: post #34
oldmancoyote wrote: post #4

I actually haven't met many being a scientific programmer in a science with little need for programming. So, I guess I'm the most talented. I was at my best in my 40's, but at 72 I'm still very good, but slow.

Care to tell what makes you slower, compared to your 40-ies? We need to prepare ;-)

It's the cumulative effect of lots of things. When I pose a question to my subconscious, it takes longer to get an answer. I make a few more mistakes, especially jumping to conclusions. It takes longer to debug them. Sustaining a train of thought is more difficult as my ADHD is a little worse, but writing out my thought processes (often in Q and A form) helps tremendously. Getting a synoptic view is definitely harder. All these things slow me down.

On the other hand, 51 years of adapting to new technology has strengthened my confidence that I can cope with problems. Having lost the usual confidence of youth, I have replaced it with determination based on the repeated experience of failure and the knowledge that I have overcome them. It's a different kind of confidence.

I am greatly envious of the education you folks have, but I make do.

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#176

Post by oldmancoyote »

thanatropism wrote: post #137
lbriner wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this might describe what you are referring to: https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/02/170206155947.h... I heard somebody say that as you age, you rely more on memory to infer the correct decision whereas when you are young, memories are few and decisions based either on gut feel or the current context. I guess that means that older people are more likely to do something they have already done because i…

There's still a lot of nature vs. nurture to that. A lot more experience = a lot more failures.

"A lot more experience = a lot more failures." YES. Your failures both form you and inform you at least as much as your successes.

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#178

Post by imhoguy »

rotten wrote: post #86
spinach wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That begs the question then, what happens to these early-20s geniuses once they are late 20s/30s?

Life gets in the way for a while: Kids. Spouse/partner. House. Hobbies. Cynicism. Burnout. Health. Elder care. Then things settle. You work through the life thing, and in your 50's you get a fresh perspective and new energy.

I would also add massive family debt/mortgage to this list. I saw so many star engineers fear-driven and stagnating in their tiny comfort zones to the burn-out or layoff.

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#179

Post by hluska »

sierdolij wrote: post #36
joejerryronnie wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The ageism in SV has very little to do with actual talent and productivity and much more with how the team feels someone can handle themselves at happy hour.

I think there's three components to every employment position: - sufficient work ability, rarely an issue. - teamwork - at work interface, negotiating, empathy with others. be relentlessly resourceful and useful, but get yours too. - off-the-clock skills and interpersonal/appearance likability - a bunch of awkward single dudes can't say "no" to the socially-calibrated dude who goes out and convinces a bunch of attrac…

How the fuck does convincing a group of women to hang out have anything to do with work? It doesn't and the idea that it should is the cause of lots of huge problems in this industry.

Re: Ask HN: How old were the most talented software engineers you've met?

#180

Post by thanatropism »

oldmancoyote wrote: post #176
thanatropism wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's still a lot of nature vs. nurture to that. A lot more experience = a lot more failures.

"A lot more experience = a lot more failures." YES. Your failures both form you and inform you at least as much as your successes.

They also make you more pessimistic. Maybe rightly so.
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