Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses • Hacker News Board

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#171

Post by MrTonyD » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:03 PM UTC

todopoderoso wrote: post #108

mettamage wrote: post #52

So wait, there are places where there are houses being given away (e.g. US, Japan and Italy as far as I know) and I'm a person that has the ability to work remotely. Am I missing something? Is this my ticket to cheap housing and a more stress free life? At what point am I going to be scammed and/or disappointed?

If you're working remotely and want cheap housing and a slower life, and you're interested in moving to some random place abroad, why wait on an opportunity like this? Have you considered just moving somewhere much cheaper? I work from a beach in Mexico, pay almost nothing, and have a nice and slow life. And... it's a beach! Obviously, there are plenty of places in the world to do this from if Mexico isn't your thing…

Where in Mexico? I've often thought about moving there, but I hesitate mostly because of crime. I also have a neighbor who lived there for almost a decade, until they were shaken-down by the Federales (with actual gunfights and shallow graves in his story! So they moved back to the US.)

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#172

Post by lioeters » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:04 PM UTC

scarecrowbob wrote: post #115

komali2 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you're right, for a person like you or me it could be terrifying. But huge swaths of the population enjoy this lifestyle - in the USA they mostly depend on cars, ATVs, or horses to get around (speaking from my Texas experience). It's not city life, but it's life. It's just a little bit "slower" sometimes. It can be relaxing in its own way. I mean, I live in the core of SF, but how often do I go to the theater or…

Personally, I am looking to buy a place in Llano or Blanco (between Austin and Fredericksburg, basically) in summer of 2019 and then spend a lot of time camping and visiting people and travelling. Just because you're remotely based in the sticks and use property there as a place to park equity and a place to keep your big stuff (I have a lot of tools and music equipment) doesn't mean you have to stay there if you're…

Years ago, I lived with a friend in Blanco for a few months - a little house built by the owner on the top of a hill, with a big garden, horses, goats, chickens, dogs, as well as occasional rattle snake or scorpion.

It was fairly isolated (in a comforting way), so having access to an automobile was a necessity. If I recall, about ~1 hour to Austin, with a lively music scene.

I learned how the Texas hill country can be quite charming - wildflowers, forests, rivers.. Fond memories. Good luck with finding a homestead there!

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#173

Post by snackbugs » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:05 PM UTC

blocked_again wrote: post #73

titanix2 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, you're missing that foreigners are not the target of these deals. Also it's not terribly complicated to get a visa to come here: you basically need at least a bachelor degree and to find a job. Given how the job market is starving for employees, it is not really hard. I know a half-dozen people of my country and my age that did it.

Aren't software engineers treated badly in Japan?

Work culture in general is harsher, but a lot of professional jobs include benefits like housing (usually not too far from full rent) and full commute expenses in their compensation. These are perks usually added to your base salary, which is one of the things foreigners ignore when bringing up stories of lower salaries and harsh work culture. You take your pick which is more important to you when thinking about whether or not to live in Japan.

There's a stronger social contract in place than in other places. Work culture is harsher in terms of hours expected in the office than elsewhere, but there is a stronger respect for workers' material conditions as well.

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#174

Post by samstave » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:08 PM UTC

megaman8 wrote: post #65

mrnobody_67 wrote: post #33

Solution to SF homelessness problem.

i don't know why this is being downvoted. the core idea is a good one. Start moving people away from expensive areas and have them populate areas like the rust belt where housing is much cheaper. Detroit is pretty cost effective as others have mentioned.

What exactly would these people do in a place like detroits dilapitated housing wasteland for prosperity, work and money?

You'd need to create a subsidized economy for some decade or such to build it up.

Here is an idea - if a company like Amazon wants to move into NYC, as an example, rather than paying them ~3B to do so, why not require large companies to pay to subsidize a revival city in detroit.

Where those resources will be made to build out the core infrastructure needed to support a city there.

Rather than spending $700 billion dollars a year on defense spending, spend $70 billion to rebuild/build-out a new detroit? Want a city based solely on self-driving cars, wifi only, with small-sized apartment/tiny-home housing and many micro-lot farms?

A bold attempt at building out something would be nice to try again in this country. We need it.

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#175

Post by dsfyu404ed » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:08 PM UTC

fromthestart wrote: post #166

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I have[1][2]. It's really not bad unless you drive yourself nuts worrying about things that will probably never happen to you. Yes, you see and hear the effects of crime everywhere but as long as your not know by your neighbors to be an ass, your house is harder to rob than most of the nearby ones and you don't associate with the wrong people you'll be fine. It's not like there's stray bullets coming through your…

According to the Wikipedia page for Fitchburg >the median income for a family was $57,245. Males had a median income of $47,350 versus $37,921 for females. The per capita income for the city was $22,972. About 14.6% of families and 19.4% of the population were below the poverty line Compare this with an area like Greenspoint in Houston, where middle class office workers are regularly warned of muggings outside their…

What are the income stats for all of Houston?

Fitchburg is an entire city (albeit a small one). Like Houston it has bad and good areas (I don't think there's any gated communities though). The nice areas are quite nice. The not nice areas are rows of boarded up houses that have been stripped of all the copper. Every rust belt city is like this. The ratios just vary.

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#176

Post by MrTonyD » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:11 PM UTC

ska wrote: post #18

masklinn wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's probably the only country in the world where "used homes" are considered something to be ashamed of. That's generally true though it depends on the specifics e.g. they would renovate and maintain things like temples, ryokan or major multi-generational homes. It's the "personal" homes which are considered disposable (pretty much anything you'd have in a suburbs in the US for instance).

US is becoming more like that over time too, if you look at a lot of the new builds in subdivisions it's hard to imagine them lasting that long. I wonder if at some point the cultural attitude to "old houses" will become more like Japan's. [edit]: I find the downvotes curious - I know plenty of people living in ~120 year old houses, and plenty living in 5-15 year old new builds in subdivisions. None of us can really…

I consider downvotes on HN to be a badge of honor. It means you are thinking of things that the small-thinkers don't like, and probably will never take the time to seriously consider. Don't let it stop you - there are still people here who want to hear different and innovative perspectives - and we won't downvote you for sharing a perspective that we may not agree with.

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#177

Post by Animats » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:12 PM UTC

fromthestart wrote: post #98

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have lived in crappy neighborhoods[1][2]. Violence is not likely to be an issue as long as you don't inject yourselves into your neighbors' business it's really not the big deal the upper classes make it out to be with all their hand wringing. Violent crime doesn't really happen that often per capita (i.e. odds are it will never happen to you). Not getting involved with drugs is like 90% of the battle. If you do ge…

You've clearly never lived in a shitty neighborhood.

I have. Cleveland, Detroit, Chicago, New Jersey. Few problems.

Only in Menlo Park, CA did I hear automatic weapons fire on the weekends. That was before East Palo Alto closed down Whiskey Gulch, flattened the area, and put in a Four Seasons hotel and an office building full of lawyers.

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#178

Post by samstave » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:13 PM UTC

innocentoldguy wrote: post #152

I went to Japan in March to buy one of these houses for a vacation home (I go to Japan once or twice a year). I could have bought a decent sized house in rural Japan for about $20,000 at the time, but most of them I looked at needed a ton of work and there weren't many shopping areas and other amenities nearby. I ended up buying an older condo just outside of Tokyo and fixing that up instead. It cost more, but it wor…

Mind sharing what you had to spend? This would be fascinating to do, but would be great to know the actual costs involved.

Also, would you share, more in depth, the experience as a whole: Do you speak Japanese, married to a Japanese citizen/are one? What was the biggest unexpected etc...

Basically, a blog post about such an endeavor would be great reading...

THanks

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#179

Post by yardie » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:16 PM UTC

rzzzt wrote: post #146

yardie wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a lot more complex than that. Usually these deals have tax liabilities and liens that aren't chargeable unless the city agrees to it. Anyone can tell you, there is nothing more expensive than a free house/boat/car.

Why don't they sell it at a discount, then?

These are usually handled through city property auctions. Bidding usually starts at a few dollars. But you have to read the fine print. They will usually have city, county, state, federal, and private liens on them.

For example a federal treasury auction will discharge IRS tax liens but not state, county, and city charges. I've seen $1mm beach-side homes auctioned for A savvy buyer will get the titles and try to get the liens discharged by negotiating with the other agencies or pay them off. This is factored into the offer they will make on the property. If you think you've stumbled into a method to get rich quick you're sadly mistaken.

Re: Japan Is Giving Away 8M Abandoned Houses

#180

Post by iandanforth » Wed, Nov 28, 2018, 9:17 PM UTC

The more interesting thing about this is that it is part of a new type of economics, contraction economics. The global trend toward birth rates below replenishment means that first-world countries are maintaining their population growth through immigration. As some countries embrace restrictions on immigration, and ultimately all countries plateau in their population growth (projected to be around 2100) it means that the driving force behind increases in property value (population increases) will be curtailed.*

As we saw in 2008 curtailing or reversing growth in real-estate can have major impacts on society, but in the future this won't be just a correction it will be a new phase of global economics. There will be fewer humans each year making the total pressure on land values negative. Even before that an aging workforce will cause the total working population to contract (as it already has in Japan). Everything the Japanese do with more land and fewer workers is a canary in the coal mine for the global economy.

One of the great predicates of modern economics (perpetual expansion) will need to be re-thought. In some ways it's great news (more space for everyone after the great pinch of the 21st century) but in others it will necessarily wipe out the speculative aspect of many current growth markets. Contraction economics means deflation becomes a norm not an exception.

* Urbanization means cities will lag behind this reversal.