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Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

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Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#171

Post by hakfoo »

joecot wrote: post #136
LarryL wrote: post #17

The title of the article is misleading, it's not programming that is the real issue, it's billing (the progamming issues are just a part in the article). Since the Credit Card companies & banks create lots of problems as soon as sex is involved (see FetLife's misadventures in HN previous articles for instance) in addition to the big chargebacks issue, and given that customers lie a lot (because they can), I think tha…

The problem is that most consumers don't plan ahead for wanting to buy a porn subscription. It's a spur of the moment decision. Any form of barrier you put in front of that decision -- whether it's extra verification, or a different digital currency they need to buy, or a prepaid card just for adult content -- drastically reduces the percentage of surfers that go from "guy looking at the site's preview page" to "guy…

I wonder if fraud could be reduced by creating a "push" payment model instead of pull. Not just for adult sites, but for e-commerce in general.

The form says "To subscribe, remit $25 to account 12345678, and paste the transaction ID into this field." The merchant could then verify that the transaction ID matched up with a payment he received and complete the sale.

With a standardized microformat for the payment data, this could probably all be detectable and streamlined into browser plugins or apps-- you'd just see a button that redirects you to log into your bank's site with the transfer details prewired.

I figure this has plenty of benefits:

* The only remotely sensitive data you pass to the merchant is a transaction ID. You'd probably be able to actually do the sale without SSL, but certainly without most of the PCI compliance hassle.

* The merchant can't use the info you provided to enable an unexpected second charge or subscription.

* The bank can choose to make their process for executing the push transactions as "easy" or as "secure" as they (or the users) want. The merchant doesn't have to know, care, or worse, spend money to retool their site to support changes.

In a way, PayPal's flow is sort of push-oriented, but it's ugly in a lot of ways.

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#172

Post by dang »

caruana wrote: post #131
moneylaundering wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work on money laundering cases. What the poster admitted to doing, particularly in the comments section, reads like money laundering. I have used emails more vague than this write-up against defendants in money laundering cases. The underlying crime would be bank fraud, wire fraud, or mail fraud, or all three, depending on how a particular merchant account was opened, how transactions were processed, and who the pa…

You created your account 3 hours ago, with a creative name and then annonymously post you work on money laundering cases ... As if that is supposed to add credit or show some sort of background. You are anonymous, don't try and take some high ground to reinforce an invalid argument.

It's more complex than that. Sometimes people create throwaway accounts so they can share more information than they'd otherwise be able to, and really are experts or insiders on a topic. It's not always easy to tell such cases apart from fabricators or trolls, but it's important to try, and to give people the benefit of the doubt. I generally go by how substantive the comments are or seem (admittedly not an infallible test).

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#173

Post by enwa »

stevenicr wrote: post #170
kkop wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is certainly part of it, but it is also about capability. They don't know how to make it work, maybe especially not in their own heads. The same is true for developers. Seniority is largely measured in how good you are at delivering what is fundamentally correct without compromising. While lesser programmers will convince themselves that it is unnecessary or that their own solution is good enough.

Actually, some of the top notch, well funded production companies tried to make it work. They knew how to make it work. Was it Wicked(?) (one of the big name, well experienced, well funded companies) that tried to make all their hired performers wear protection, even married couples. They had top notch good looking talent, professional camera people, great lighting, costumes, everything. I think they made some money…

That isn't really making it work. Look at the UFC. Total spectacle when it was first acquired, now it is one of the largest sports in the US. Largely because they are ahead of the regulation. People who want to compete by being a spectacle don't get licenses and access to large arenas. If they would have known how to make it work there would be a similar situation for payment processing and free sites as well.

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#175

Post by istorical »

bsder wrote: post #147

This is such a shame because the porn industry used to be at the forefront of technological innovation. Quite often, the AVN Expo had better actual technical content than CES (which was held at the same time). The porn industry was the first to adopt videodiscs, VHS, DVD, handheld cameras, the web, online payments, etc. Basically, if any new technology was useful for porn, it was going to catch on.

If you look at VR film making, they are still at the forefront. Camera rigs evolving at lightspeed.

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#176

Post by scarface74 »

stevenicr wrote: post #168
scarface74 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All prepaid cards are anonymous. You pay for the card with cash.

I thought some were anonymous when paid with cash, however some of those require that they are activated using a web browser and they request additional info, some requiring physical address and SS that match some database in order to use them. I have also seen some businesses refuse to take a prepaid cash card, some saying nothing, and others saying that they can not process such a card as recurring billing is block…

Now it makes sense. Some vendors may not take a prepaid card if they can’t verify that the card matches an address with the card. I would assume this would especially be the case for online merchants shipping physical goods.

In that case, you may have to provide an address on a website.

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#177

Post by smsm42 »

crtasm wrote: post #143

Post has been deleted. > To those of you spreading the "you're admitting to fraud" comments, you're the reason we can't have nice things. I fail to see how this forced you to remove the post.

Maybe because the author expected sincere discussion of the problems they are facing, and got a storm of crap dumped on their head by people who spent all of 2 minutes on the issue but already know everything about it and are very judgmental about it. There is no shortage of those on the internet, and dealing with them is very annoying. Not everybody can tolerate such environment.

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#178

Post by lagadu »

teekert wrote: post #34
lagadu wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can understand that companies prefer not to be associated with a world that seemingly contains a lot of misery. They're already in the pharma and health business.

I understand the down voting and I also understand your response. But wouldn't it be nice if there were fair-trade porn sites? Where we know people are treated an paid well? It's insane that there is so much for free while there is so much work involved.

I completely agree, I recall running into a couple here and there but the only one I know from memory that attempts that is kink.com (or so they say).

Re: Programming in the Adult Entertainment Industry Is Broken

#179

Post by asobalife »

forapurpose wrote: post #161
stickfigure wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This analysis is still missing something essential. "Adult merchants are more likely to have chargebacks" is akin to saying "Blacks are more likely to commit violent crimes". In terms of overall statistics, it's factually true, but there's still something reprehensible about judging individuals this way. When I was at kink.com (10 years ago), our chargeback rate was tiny - lower than most online businesses, and nowhe…

African-Americans and the discrimination against them are not at all comparable to to pornographers and their problems getting payments processed. These are entirely different things with very different causes and with consequences that are orders of magnitude apart.

African American here. The comparison is actually pretty apt. Deliberate, systemic economic barriers put up against those seeking to do legitimate business due to blanket group policy (see banks like Wells Fargo who are STILL doing redlining and race-based credit rationing today) actually encourages illegal activity for people trying to make a living. And lets not forget the sex workers who are creating the content sold by porn sites. Law after law pushed by both conservatives and "progressives" that criminalize even their responsible activities, make it difficult for them to bank, and making them even more vulnerable to bad actors.

The consequences are actually more or less the same - sex workers have much higher rates of mental health issues, victimization to violence, and lower life expectancy. Pretty much the same types of problems faced by (esp low income) black Americans. For largely the same structural economic reasons.

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