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How Does Mastodon Work?

kevq.uk

171–180 of 186 posts

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#171
post #46

The failure to mention GNU Social, which Mastodon is almost completely based upon and which birthed the Fediverse, is just weird.

Mastodon is not based on GNU Social in any way other than they both used the OStatus protocol. Before ActivityPub became the norm. GNU Social is made in PHP and Mastodon is made with Ruby and NodeJS. So two wildly different implementations. Mastodon also looked more modern and followed more so called modern developing practices. Which is why I think it caught on more than GNU Social ever did.

The kindness, quality, and eagerness to help is a big part of what propelled Mastodon. You'd log in, make your first toot, and have a pile of people welcoming you from the federated or local timeline. Same with beginner questions.

I tried GNU Social a long time ago, but it was mostly technical people talking about technical stuff. Great if that's what you're into, but it's no basis for a general use social network. Niche networks are fine, but I don't get the impression that's what early federated social media proponents wanted.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#172

I'm not sure if this will be relevant to its longer-term success, but I notice that the word "Mastodon" seems to be very easy to misspell -- In the comments here alone I already find "Mastadon", "Mastadoon", etc.

I am curious why they have misspelled the Mastodon? In many languages it is written and spelled in the same way. I am not native speaker but I would pronounce mastadon and mastodon in the same way (ˈmæstədɑn), but hardly I can imagine to write down as mastadon. > First attested 1813, from the New Latin genus name Mastodon (1806), coined by French naturalist Georges Cuvier, from Ancient Greek μαστός (mastós, “breast”)…

In the US at least people spell based on how words sound in their head if they don't really remember the correct way to spell it.

No one is thinking about the history of the word, in fact I personally was wondering why they chose an elephant as their mascot until I remembered what a Mastodon was.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#173
post #46

The failure to mention GNU Social, which Mastodon is almost completely based upon and which birthed the Fediverse, is just weird.

Mastodon is not based on GNU Social in any way other than they both used the OStatus protocol. Before ActivityPub became the norm. GNU Social is made in PHP and Mastodon is made with Ruby and NodeJS. So two wildly different implementations. Mastodon also looked more modern and followed more so called modern developing practices. Which is why I think it caught on more than GNU Social ever did.

Even so, it is still weird to pretend that everything in the Fediverse is Mastodon.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#174
post #122

I joined a server. It was alright. Then I looked at the federated timeline and decided I did not wish to be a part of Mastadon. Too much hate and virtue signalling. It was like what Twitter already was.

> Too much hate and virtue signalling. It was like what Twitter already was. Thanks for virtue signalling. Ironic.

>> Too much hate and virtue signalling. It was like what Twitter already was.

> Thanks for virtue signalling. Ironic.

Thanks for virtue signalling. Ironic.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There has historically always only been one sensible email provider. It was your ISP, and then it was gmail.

I've never used my ISP provided email. Even before gmail, I used other gmail-ish ones (hotmail, yahoo &c.)

Just as I've tried to do with my email for a long time now, I decided to have my own Mastodon instance on a domain I control.

Email does show us a greater need in Mastodon to emphasize trust-relationships over ill-defined "social groups" as better ways to form relationships. In the early days of email, the ISP was an easily formed trust relationship, and in today's arena a lot of people have preferred trust relationships to hosts like Google (Gmail) or Microsoft (Hotmail/Outlook), etc. The "people interested in Topic X" that most of the instance lists are focused on doesn't give you any information towards trust relationships, and is possibly in the way of forming them.

The immediate problem is that those large companies like Google or Microsoft with lots established trust relationships aren't expected to play in Mastodon/ActivityPub, so you need to bootstrap new ones. Luckily, there's a lot of room for trying to bootstrap new trust relationships. Some instances have already been playing with ownership models, and companies are easy enough to form if people want to place those ownership models into transparently accountable units/liability-protected units that are recognized by larger governing bodies than just themselves.

A friend I follow, Darius (@darius@tinysubversions.com), has also been ruminating on this quirk in Mastodon adoption lately and trying to find ways to establish trust relationships with instances, though so far his solution is to stick to a smaller scope and start with the idea of "you trust me, so let me host your instance" among friends. That idea might scale if there were enough folks like Darius doing that, and I've sent very simple invites to possibly add friends to my instance that I control, and have been looking to come up with governance documents based on that idea, but haven't yet had anyone take me up on that invite, so I keep procrastinating it.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#176
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I wish the author had expanded on migration from one instance to another and what it entails (similar to the questions and responses here). Account migration is not a thing yet, and conceptually requires a new namespace for referencing accounts (such as public keys). There is a multi-year-long actively-discussed open issue thread about this problem. https://github.com/tootsuite/mastodon/issues/177

This should work like Domain web Hosting type. So you can register your id at one place (similar to domain with any tld registrar) and change to another instance (web hosting). So you do not lose the need to change the id when changing instance.

You can do that today in the same way that email allows it: register your own domain and you can find a Mastodon host to service it and even CNAME it to a different Mastodon host if your needs change or a hosting provider becomes broken. It is part of why it was important to me to use an instance on a domain I control.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is unfortunate. I consider myself a highly skilled technical user, and the burden of running and maintaining my own Mastodon server, or even my own Nginx server to redirect WebFinger requests somewhere else, exceeds the free time I have to devote to the problem. (Keeping another VM alive, updated, and configured through the years costs mental energy, time, and money.) Whereas, adding an SRV record to my existin…

I don't understand why these federated social networks don't use standard email addresses for identity.

It's easy from the one direction: There's nothing stopping instance hosts from also hosting email addresses that match user account names. It might even be a good idea for some instances, in keeping a trust relationship, if your Mastodon instance was also your email provider of choice.

From the other direction is tougher, because you have a many-to-many relationship to try to consider. It's a variation of the problems of OG OpenID and/or Mozilla Persona (RIP to both). If I want to use example.account@gmail.com, how do you map that to a "main" instance if you can't ask gmail.com because Google doesn't currently care about WebFinger or ActivityPub? Do you use a central database somewhere? Does that defeat the goals of decentralization you were going for in the first place?

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#178
post #34
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this is a good use case for keybase.io It aggregates known (proven) identities, allows all currently verified identities to prove ownership of your next new one.

I thought of that too. But just keybase.io wouldn't be acceptable, because it's centralized. However, I vaguely remember language about Keybase being a protocol, and not just a site. But I've never used anything but keybase.io and indeed haven't heard about federation. But then there's https://keybase.io/kbpgp/ so ???

The Keybase verifications (sigchain) are also encoded into the Bitcoin blockchain in addition to stored on their servers if you wanted a more distributed way to check them. https://keybase.io/docs/server_security/merkle_root_in_bitco...

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never used my ISP provided email. Even before gmail, I used other gmail-ish ones (hotmail, yahoo &c.)

Just as I've tried to do with my email for a long time now, I decided to have my own Mastodon instance on a domain I control. Email does show us a greater need in Mastodon to emphasize trust-relationships over ill-defined "social groups" as better ways to form relationships. In the early days of email, the ISP was an easily formed trust relationship, and in today's arena a lot of people have preferred trust relations…

Broadly speaking, is Mastodon a healthy, non-addictive, non-abusive Twitter alternative that happens to leverage federation to achieve its aims? Or is Mastodon a FLOSS celebration of federation applied to the domain of social networking?

If it's the former, then I don't understand the problem you're describing. Why can't trust simply be a hierarchy from the Mastodon devs-- who you have to trust anyway-- down to a small, diverse set of the largest and most performant instances (as defined by those devs themselves)? That would cover the vast majority of users and still obviously leave room for anyone who wants to run their own instance.

Even if the vast majority of users/devs think it's unethical to have a hierarchy/centralization, as you point out there isn't any known alternative at present. So the only practical alternative is to punt, which inhibits adoption and hardens the implicit social group hierarchies which you point out are problematic.

Re: How Does Mastodon Work?

#180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There seems to be a lot of "city" spam. See https://mstdn.io/tags/sydney for example. Its about 80% escort ads.

That's not spam. That's from people on Switter. It's an instance for sex workers.

Hashtagging dozens of cities though? These look like spam ads for the pimps.
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