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Farewell, Google Maps

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Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#171

Post by bhhaskin »

bflesch wrote: post #58

I think it is positive that google finally reaches a sane price point with maps. As the comparison in the blog post shows, the whole market of map providers looked at what gmaps is charging and kind of went along with a price in the same category. The higher price allows them to actually get paid for the value they provide to various startups, which - as they pointed out in the blog post - would not exist without the…

Here is the problem. When Google first launched Maps it was free and they ran all of the other competition out of business. Now that all their competition are dead they want to charge for it. If that doesn't scream antitrust I don't know what else does. Google has grown maps using pretty shady tactics. Their data is only so good due to mining data from all the Android users and I bet Street View has a lot of government money behind it.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#172

Post by fenwick67 »

writepub wrote: post #159

This is bad design on the OP's part. I hail from hardware where, for instance, Apple chooses 3 providers for it's SSDs (SanDisk, Samsung, Intel, ...) to shield itself from price gouging, supply issues with any single party, business concerns, etc.. However, I routinely see entire companies based on single providers despite choice existing in the marketplace. The OP should have designed their service around multiple m…

SSDs all have standard interfaces (SATA or whatever), so you can easily swap them out. Conversely, Google Maps doesn't let you implement your own pan/zoom layer on top of their maps API, you have to use their APIs.

Yes you could create a compatibility layer for this, but really that seems like a lot of pre-work for something so unforeseen.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#173

Post by foobarbazetc »

bflesch wrote: post #71
alrex021 wrote: post #44

In our own experience, we pleaded the fact that those dollar figures are just beyond workable if you consider the fact that we come from a developing country and we're faced with ~20x jump. I.e. it heavily messes with the unit economics. The Google representative actually laughed in our face (via Hangout).

If you get into trouble with your unit economics given such a raise, then you really need to think about your business model. How much value is your business really creating ON TOP of the maps? I don't want to be snarky, but I think many businesses don't think enough about this issue of value creation.

Name one business that can absorb a 20x increase in a component cost.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#174

Post by Retra »

komali2 wrote: post #163
anarazel wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, I find it helpful. Stating the level of confidence, and that's what IANAL is to some degree, is helpful in judging a statement.

Warning: completely unrelated to thread topic. Poor grandparent got nuked in the votes, but I actually think this is an interesting discussion. It ties to my thoughts about politeness and behavior on the internet, which ties to my thoughts about the same IRL. Dale Carnegie, "How to Win Friends" type stuff. Is it effective to "hedge" your arguments/posts/words with a "now I might be wrong" / "you may know more about t…

A lawyer wouldn't have to hedge and say "IANAL." Why would we expect Torvalds to hedge? He's the expert in change of his project.

Etc..

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#175

Post by scottydelta »

writepub wrote: post #159

This is bad design on the OP's part. I hail from hardware where, for instance, Apple chooses 3 providers for it's SSDs (SanDisk, Samsung, Intel, ...) to shield itself from price gouging, supply issues with any single party, business concerns, etc.. However, I routinely see entire companies based on single providers despite choice existing in the marketplace. The OP should have designed their service around multiple m…

When developing web apps, it is not possible to write the code for the alternative platforms aswell. We are not just talking about changing tiles but also alot of manipulations with the maps in terms of layers, polygons, routes, markers etc on the map.

What you are saying is already done in places where it can be, for eg, use of ORMs allow the application to be connected with a variety of DBs and your DB queries and application become independent of the underlying DB.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#176

Post by sillysaurus3 »

komali2 wrote: post #163
anarazel wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW, I find it helpful. Stating the level of confidence, and that's what IANAL is to some degree, is helpful in judging a statement.

Warning: completely unrelated to thread topic. Poor grandparent got nuked in the votes, but I actually think this is an interesting discussion. It ties to my thoughts about politeness and behavior on the internet, which ties to my thoughts about the same IRL. Dale Carnegie, "How to Win Friends" type stuff. Is it effective to "hedge" your arguments/posts/words with a "now I might be wrong" / "you may know more about t…

This ArenaNet situation sounds interesting. Could you post a link to it? I don't see much in search results.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#177

Post by nullicorn »

tomcam wrote: post #156

It seems remarkably naive to assume a high quality business that is obviously expensive to run would remain free.

The problem isn't that Google Maps is not free, nor is it that they increased its price, but rather __how they went about__ increasing its price.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#178

Post by komali2 »

Retra wrote: post #174
komali2 wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Warning: completely unrelated to thread topic. Poor grandparent got nuked in the votes, but I actually think this is an interesting discussion. It ties to my thoughts about politeness and behavior on the internet, which ties to my thoughts about the same IRL. Dale Carnegie, "How to Win Friends" type stuff. Is it effective to "hedge" your arguments/posts/words with a "now I might be wrong" / "you may know more about t…

A lawyer wouldn't have to hedge and say "IANAL." Why would we expect Torvalds to hedge? He's the expert in change of his project. Etc..

A lawyer can be wrong, and so can Torvalds, but yea, they may be more likely to be wrong.

Nobody has to, but in my experience, you do seem to get a much more positive reaction when you do.

At least in Western culture, it seems a well played "humble" character is admirable, especially when it is known that the particular person has absolutely no reason to be humble.

EDIT: I don't expect anybody to hedge "just because", but I expect that a person with extremely good interpersonal communication skills to hedge.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#179

Post by magicalist »

bhhaskin wrote: post #171
bflesch wrote: post #58

I think it is positive that google finally reaches a sane price point with maps. As the comparison in the blog post shows, the whole market of map providers looked at what gmaps is charging and kind of went along with a price in the same category. The higher price allows them to actually get paid for the value they provide to various startups, which - as they pointed out in the blog post - would not exist without the…

Here is the problem. When Google first launched Maps it was free and they ran all of the other competition out of business. Now that all their competition are dead they want to charge for it. If that doesn't scream antitrust I don't know what else does. Google has grown maps using pretty shady tactics. Their data is only so good due to mining data from all the Android users and I bet Street View has a lot of governme…

> When Google first launched Maps it was free and they ran all of the other competition out of business. Now that all their competition are dead they want to charge for it.

Were there any significant competing maps APIs for the web in 2005? There may have been (and you seem so certain I'm sure you could name them all :P), but it's crazy to claim that there aren't far more competitors in the last 5 years than there were back then. Just look at the article, which is literally about all the competition available.

Re: Farewell, Google Maps

#180

Post by flukus »

megous wrote: post #86
megous wrote: post #75

> Google Maps is objectively the best product on its market, in many regards positioned light years ahead of its competitors. No. Google maps is an absolute, washed out turd style wise. We have much better local competitor. Compare this: https://www.google.com/maps/@50.081478,14.4272906,13z https://mapy.cz/zakladni?x=14.4068130&y=50.0892746&z=13 You can try various zoom levels, and mapy.cz is always better. Much more…

I could navigate the city with a map printed even at that zoom level, but good luck trying to do that with google maps. That's the single most important point for the map. I didn't consciously try to compare the maps before, but looking at the differences now, google maps seem thoughtless and completely random at what is highlighted, how parts of the city are named (some use names, some numbers, for no reason), what…

One zoom level in from that it shows the names of all the major roads, glorious. With google maps it seems you sometimes have to zoom right in to where a road is half the screen to see the names. I switch to OsmAnd on my phone for exactly this reason.
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