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What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

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Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#171

Post by carlmr »

Pokepokalypse wrote: post #150
jjeaff wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they necessarily make up the prices, but I wonder if there is an accounting reason for the "MSRP" on procedures being so high. I will frequently see things like a $2,000 charge to the insurance company and then it will show that they ended up paying something like $185 for the service and they disallow the rest. Perhaps it is just to make sure they always get the max from the insurance companies. Or may…

I've heard explanations that it has to do with something called "pay master" software, which sets the prices - but they do set a high price as a negotiating point for insurance companies. Personally, I believe this practice to be outright blatant fraud. There is a complete lack of price-transparency for the end-user, whether there's an insurance company involved or not. And for people who supposedly champion the so-c…

That's what I read as well. Basically we need price transparency, insurances paying the same as the non-insured, and lower awards in law suits against hospitals/doctors and America would have one of the cheapest healthcare systems in the world in no time.

Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#172

Post by carlmr »

nitwit005 wrote: post #163
smachiz wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't really do that in the middle of surgery...

The auto mechanic can't really ask for permission to use a fire extinguisher if the car catches fire either. No one minds if there are common sense exceptions.

In happy-to-sue America, you need to have a codified common sense so that we don't end up with doctors getting sued for using their common sense.

Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#173

Post by wu-ikkyu »

Pokepokalypse wrote: post #160
tmnvix wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep. An interesting bit of data that highlights just how profitable this industry can be comes from the wikipedia page for McKesson Corporation[1]: > On June 24, 2013, The Wall Street Journal reported that McKesson Chairman and CEO John Hammergren's pension benefits of $159 million had set a record for "the largest pension on file for a current executive of a public company, and almost certainly the largest ever in c…

yes, and before anyone says: "but muh R&D funding!" -- these companies generally have marketing budgets that are 2-3 times the R&D budget. (plus, most basic research is public or university funded). "but muh FDA certification costs" - - there are huge tax carve-outs for these. It's not a main driver. And no: marketing is not necessary for these products. TV commercials and other ads to public: not necessary.

Also worth noting that the US is 1 of only 2 countries in the world which allows direct advertising of drugs and also is the #1 per capita spender on drugs.

Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#174

Post by conanbatt »

wu-ikkyu wrote: post #173
Pokepokalypse wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

yes, and before anyone says: "but muh R&D funding!" -- these companies generally have marketing budgets that are 2-3 times the R&D budget. (plus, most basic research is public or university funded). "but muh FDA certification costs" - - there are huge tax carve-outs for these. It's not a main driver. And no: marketing is not necessary for these products. TV commercials and other ads to public: not necessary.

Also worth noting that the US is 1 of only 2 countries in the world which allows direct advertising of drugs and also is the #1 per capita spender on drugs.

Its incredible to me that an ad for prescription drugs can target consumers and pay off. I understand aspirin or over the counter stuff, but "ask your doctor about this drug" pays off? How is that reasonable at all.

Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#175

Post by GFischer »

tomohawk wrote: post #167
serichsen wrote: post #122

From my german perspective, every assumption in this article looks quite gross and barbaric. Here, everyone is insured. If you break your arm, you get it fixed. If you get cancer, you get therapy. If you get the flu, you get a prescription. The overall cost is paid by the entire population, through the insurance system. For what is the alternative? Maybe the overall monetary cost would be lower if everyone had to wat…

From my American perspective, the national health systems of other countries have their own barbarities. There is a reason why so many people from other countries come to the US for health care. When I was looking to have a very serious health problem taken care of, I heavily researched getting the procedure done anywhere in the world. It was pretty obvious that all the best places to have it done were in the US. The…

Well, actually, at least the reason why the very rich nationals from my country elect to have surgery in the U.S. is because the very best doctors are there - possibly because they're extremely well remunerated there, and the best research is done in the U.S. as well.

I wonder if the insurance we're talking about covers the kind of procedure people from other countries do in the U.S.

I absolutely trust medical professionals in my country and I believe we have some of the very best healthcare in the world - way better than in the U.S. - wait time for an MRI is same-day if needed (same as you say for the U.S.), surgery is 13 days and the cost is maybe 30 dollars for the ticket. No deductibles, no hidden costs. Zero people became bankrupt due to medical emergencies in my country (plenty of other causes like high taxes, but nothing directly medical-related).

But if I had the millions and I had to have open-heart surgery I would possibly choose the Cleveland Clinic, and similarly for other very serious health problems, the equivalent top clinic.

Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#176

Post by refurb »

smachiz wrote: post #95
refurb wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's no different with a car mechanic. The mechanic gives you a quote. If the costs changes they get your explicit approval. That would be nice to start there on the medical side.

Can't really do that in the middle of surgery...

Why could other scenarios be discussed prior to surgery?

Of course there may be emergencies that come up that are unpredictable, but that doesn't mean you can plan for some of it!

Re: What Happens When Doctors Only Take Cash (2017)

#177

Post by jjeaff »

Pokepokalypse wrote: post #150
jjeaff wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think they necessarily make up the prices, but I wonder if there is an accounting reason for the "MSRP" on procedures being so high. I will frequently see things like a $2,000 charge to the insurance company and then it will show that they ended up paying something like $185 for the service and they disallow the rest. Perhaps it is just to make sure they always get the max from the insurance companies. Or may…

I've heard explanations that it has to do with something called "pay master" software, which sets the prices - but they do set a high price as a negotiating point for insurance companies. Personally, I believe this practice to be outright blatant fraud. There is a complete lack of price-transparency for the end-user, whether there's an insurance company involved or not. And for people who supposedly champion the so-c…

While I agree that lots of offices don't know their costs off hand, I have not had much trouble getting quotes for specific procedures.

The real problem is that I rarely have any reason to ask if my insurance is going to cover all of it.

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