Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not like you have a right to appear in Google's search results... I'll rag on Google's poor support as much as the next guy, but only when it's warranted. ProtonMail and anyone else that gets delisted / what-have-you is not Google's client and shouldn't expect first-class support for things like this.
It is not about the right to appear in Google's search results. It is about abusing market dominance to put competing businesses at disadvantage. There are also other running/solved cases/investigations against Google. http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade/isef/case_details.cf... http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade/isef/index.cfm?fusea...
Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
171–180 of 256 posts
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#172Earlier quoted context omitted.
On much of this, it's not Google's political agenda here from what I see... it's advertisers in general. You are aware that Youtube faced a huge backlash earlier this year from large scale advertisers over "hate videos" and "extremist content": https://www.theverge.com/2017/3/24/15053990/google-youtube-a... Defining what a "hate video" and is "extremist" can be vague, so it's not surprising that some strong political…
I disagree. You are mixing together two categories: legitimately bad content (like the scary kid videos) and content does not fall in line with Google's political stance. As an advertiser you are targeting a very specific narrow population anyways and it is super easy to exclude your ads showing up in videos that you do not approve. And just a counter example to your point: https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/internet/faceb…
Let's throw a counter example on another platform. Most American talk radio is conservative. (https://www.forbes.com/sites/abrambrown/2015/07/13/why-all-t...) IMHO the reasons for this are largely demographic oriented as specified in the Forbes article -- consequently, liberal specific talk radio has not done as well as a business model since, say, the 1980s. Conservative specific talk radio has.
It's pretty easy to Google grumbling from liberals about Clear Channel being conservative and crowding out liberal talk and whatnot. These arguments seem as silly to me as the arguments about the political stance of Google (which I also think is more driven by business dollars and cents, not explicit political lean).
At any rate, what's the solution here? Force Clear Channel to host liberal political talk via government decree? That would be about as awful as forcing Youtube to monetize conservative videos via government decree.
The only arguments that make sense in this direction to me is that American radio, in effect, is a monopoly. It might be difficult to start a "liberal specific talk radio" format even if there was a solid business case for it, because the airwaves are dominated by only a few corporations. (I would argue that this actually played itself out more in the world of music -- a lot of music never crossed into the playlists of corporate radio or MTV, because of various reasons. Which is why Napster was so heavily embraced by many once it showed up.)
Likewise with Google / Youtube: I would be much more receptive to arguments along these lines. If they became a defacto monopoly (I don't think they are there yet, but this is a danger these days), only one "content policy" would exist. And that definitely would be a problem.
Hence why I think the real issue here is keeping the web open and competitive.
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#173Earlier quoted context omitted.
That would actually be okay for me. But it wouldn't be okay for google as it would directly affect their revenue model of using traffic analysis as a means to promote advertising. There's probably more money in it for them that way. But Google's right to make money doesn't trump all other rights.
Well said, making us pay them for the quality/uncensored search results basically destroys the main source of how they can create insights on data by letting people use their services for free. Google's search business is now a public utility but so far I do not see regulatory systems capable of regulating it without destroying it (catch 22 so far).
I dont think Google is quite there yet to be regulated. You have alternative like bing, and you have Duck Duck Go, and the latter actually provide pretty decent results.
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#174Earlier quoted context omitted.
It is not about the right to appear in Google's search results. It is about abusing market dominance to put competing businesses at disadvantage. There are also other running/solved cases/investigations against Google. http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade/isef/case_details.cf... http://ec.europa.eu/competition/elojade/isef/index.cfm?fusea...
Sooner or later Google will probably regulated akin to other "utilities", at least in some jurisdictions.
I like to think we are indeed slowly progressing, but at the same time it's clear that companies in power are "progressing" too. I'm unsure if humanitarian goals like this are possible if we regard them as "sooner or later it'll happen".
Interesting thought nonetheless.
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#175There are many major actors, both corporate and governmental, that don’t like privacy enhancing services like ProtonMail. No conspiracy theory, just large actors acting ruthlessly in their own self interest. This year old article is a bit bogus though. As other pointed out, the hit on SEO came from changing from .ch to .com ProtonMail, and other similar services, deserve to be supported in my opinion. I have recommen…
I switched to FastMail a while back and while reviewing options, I wanted to use ProtonMail.. but a free option seems far too unreliable for something as important as email. I need to know how they're paying the bills, basically. I prefer their incentives to be perfectly inline with mine, because I am paying their bills for my portion of usage.
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#176"Google's search results should contain exactly what I personally think they should in every case," said the HN commentator. "But they mustn't be personalized," said his boon companion. "Oh no, personalization is Evil." They nodded in agreement and upvoted each other's comments.
That's slightly different, no?
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#177Other countries are already starting work against Google. The power Google wields over the general public warrants severe investigation at even the hint of abuse of power.
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#178Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#179"Google's search results should contain exactly what I personally think they should in every case," said the HN commentator. "But they mustn't be personalized," said his boon companion. "Oh no, personalization is Evil." They nodded in agreement and upvoted each other's comments.
Re: Why Did ProtonMail Vanish from Google Search Results? (2016)
#180There are many major actors, both corporate and governmental, that don’t like privacy enhancing services like ProtonMail. No conspiracy theory, just large actors acting ruthlessly in their own self interest. This year old article is a bit bogus though. As other pointed out, the hit on SEO came from changing from .ch to .com ProtonMail, and other similar services, deserve to be supported in my opinion. I have recommen…
Is ProtonMail still free? If so, I dislike that greatly. I switched to FastMail a while back and while reviewing options, I wanted to use ProtonMail.. but a free option seems far too unreliable for something as important as email. I need to know how they're paying the bills, basically. I prefer their incentives to be perfectly inline with mine, because I am paying their bills for my portion of usage.