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Why Do We Still Commute?

citylab.com

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Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#171

Post by PeterStuer »

nunez wrote: post #61
BjoernKW wrote: post #14

I think that the 'importance of face-to-face interaction' argument is a helplessly contrived one, an attempt to avoid the elephant in the room. There are plenty of examples that show that working remotely without daily face-to-face interaction can work very well. What's markedly different about environments that successfully adopted remote work are aspects like: - a lack of cargo cult work organisation and office pol…

I personally wouldn’t want to work somewhere where I hardly ever saw my coworkers. I’m pseudo-remote as a consultant and wish I got to have more face time with my peers.

Can you tell us why?

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#172

Post by baud147258 »

A few possible reasons:

Because some can't work remotely (I'm one of those people).

Because you work in a regulated industry and no content can transit through internet.

Because the company think that it's easier to have cooperation when your colleagues are within walking distances

Because the offices are in area with efficient public transportation and available housing

Because it is harder to express yourself well in writing, compared to face-to-face

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#173

Post by jackschultz »

I've been half torn on whether in office or work from wherever is better for me. Everyone has opinions and they all seem to differ. I like how the article had back to back paragraphs linking papers that claim one is better than the other.

It'll be interesting for me coming up when I start a new job in a little over a week where I'm remote in a different city for three of the days, and then taking the hour and a half Amtrak down to where the company is based. When talking to the head of the group, the first thing I said is that I wouldn't be moving to where their office is. He was totally fine with that.

I like working on things from random places, but I'm also more than familiar working in an office with others. We'll see how this goes.

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#175

Post by kbart »

bartedinburgh wrote: post #50

I think it's connected with the rise of bullshit jobs. If your job is well defined, e.g. make an app or a website design, you can do it anywhere in the world. The app/design is your deliverable that anyone can see and judge. If your job is a poorly defined "management" or "product ownership", with no real deliverable, how can your work be judged? Your job turns into convincing other people that your job is useful. Wo…

My job is well defined and "delivery" is physical devices, but it's problematic to work remotely as I work with an actual hardware and it's not feasible to have my own, dedicated, expensive equipment at home. "Well defined" in your context mostly means web/app development, which already have high level of remote working positions, and you left a wide gap between such jobs and "bullshit" jobs.

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#176

Post by platetone »

vog wrote: post #133
codingdave wrote: post #81

I worked from home for five years, and just this week started back into a job where I commute to an office. I don't love the commute, but I also don't agree that working from home is a universally better answer for me on a personal level. Everyone knows the benefits of working from home, but there are downsides as well. Fixable downsides, but they exist nonetheless -- it is easy to become a hermit. Easy to over-work.…

> it is easy to become a hermit. Easy to over-work. Hard to draw the line between your work time and your personal time Not just that, but there's also the other side: Easy to procrastinate, easy to give false reports which then leads to regular overwork in the days just before a hard deadline. I know these issues from remote workers I worked with, but also know this personally while working on my Diploma theses. Whi…

> easy to give false reports which then leads to regular overwork in the days just before a hard deadline.

Working from home for three years now as a software project contributor, this is my biggest problem. I always get my shit done, but it gets majorly stressful since daily family life goes on the same regardless of my self-inflicted work crunches. Pretty sure the tradeoffs are still worth it, though.

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#177

Post by PeterStuer »

walshemj wrote: post #38
BjoernKW wrote: post #14

I think that the 'importance of face-to-face interaction' argument is a helplessly contrived one, an attempt to avoid the elephant in the room. There are plenty of examples that show that working remotely without daily face-to-face interaction can work very well. What's markedly different about environments that successfully adopted remote work are aspects like: - a lack of cargo cult work organisation and office pol…

unfortunately there are many more examples where it is proven that collocated teams work far better

When I did consult and visited a lot of workplaces (>95% open plan) in the IT sector, the typical 'collocated teams' reality was something like 2 to 3 socialites with apparently non too busy schedules behaving like the place was basically a bar without alcohol, free banter, jokes and non-work related conversations filled the room. Then 10 others wearing heavy headphones, always the one guy wearing explicit building site type noise protectors, and a preppy semi tech function junior type oblivious to the subliminal messages tapping people on the shoulders to get some basic info that is on the first page of the intranet or easily to google in 10 seconds. Did I already mention the 2 people that were just sitting there all day staring, waiting for the others to go home to finally find the peace to get some work done?

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#178

Post by eurticket »

wernercd wrote: post #94
gerardflo wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and then you forget to list them.

Just like you forgot to list the counter-argument examples of remote teams being better. But seriously... I would expect there to be examples of both - Good remote teams. Good office teams. Bad remote teams. Bad office teams. And every shade in between. I'd, personally, prefer a mix? Couple days in the office... couple days remote. Time to "schmooze" with the team. Time to be in a quiet place to concentrate. Why does…

I agree, we seem to shove such strict guidelines on ideas that can very easily be left to considering a mixture of both instead of one over the other.

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#179

Post by randomdata »

jheriko wrote: post #142

Why do we still commute? simple, naive answer, that ignores the context of the article: because to a very close approximation 0% of people on this planet work in an office at all, let alone an office where this is genuinely possible.

To be fair, commuting to work is a fairly new concept. In history most people would work from home as their farm was also their home.

Re: Why Do We Still Commute?

#180

Post by r2dnb »

pixl97 wrote: post #136
r2dnb wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I have nothing against MBAs, this is a typical example of what people call MBAish / corporate BS and why managerial profiles have gained a bad reputation here. It looks smart on the surface but scrutiny exposes non-sense. >Conversations around whiteboards between stakeholders creates value. Why ? Are whiteboards magic ? >Pair programming makes for lower defects and more reliable scheduling Putting aside the fac…

>Why ? Are whiteboards magic ? Anecdotally, for the amount of problems I have seen them solve in short order. Yes. They force an idea in the mind to become concrete and logically digestible to other members of the party. If you can't draw it in a manner that other people understand, you don't understand the idea well enough yourself. It is also free flowing. Ideas can be added to and removed quickly with an interface…

> They force an idea in the mind to become concrete and logically digestible to other members of the party.

You make a very valid point, what I was highlighting is that good communication can be achieved without whiteboards too.

I understand your underlying argument that whiteboards may constitute the best technology, but I also think there is a tacit convention at play here. People tacitly agree to communicate in a way that make whiteboards work. For there are many effective and fluid ways to iterate on ideas that do not involve live drawings or complex tech.

I know it for a fact as drawing my thoughts on a whiteboard has always been counter-natural to me. I can do it but I wouldn't say that it is necessary for good communication. It is just a communication choice that people make.

Everything that can be drawn clearly can also be written clearly (analogies, bullet point lists for flows, etc...). Not to say that diagrams are never helpful, but it may be a stretch to assume that drawings and whiteboards have an almost essential role.

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