I've removed all ad network code from my blog • Hacker News Board

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#171

Post by jessaustin » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:44 PM UTC

StavrosK wrote: post #94

jessaustin wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In your case, what does GA do, that something reading Cloudfront logs couldn't do?

Only two or three files are served from Cloudfront, and I'm not aware of any analytics software that reads those logs. If there is one, please let me know, I'm interested.

Sorry I don't know much about this sort of thing. It's just something that seemed conceptually possible? It's no mystery why Google would want all the data GA creates, but I've always wondered why e.g. Piwik isn't more popular.

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#172

Post by my123 » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:45 PM UTC

joekrill wrote: post #160

Wasn't this basically Google's model when the first started serving ads? 2 or 3 line text-ads only? I guess it's too bad that devolved into what we have today. Or maybe they still offer that? I have no idea.

That is Google AdWords mostly, used by themselves.

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#173

Post by arjie » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:50 PM UTC

vintageseltzer wrote: post #168

fiatjaf wrote: post #4

Ok, you have a sponsorship model that works because you're probably very famous. That doesn't solve anyone's problem, because almost no one is famous. How can we replace ad networks with something better and saner?

May I ask: if one is not "famous" (i.e. popular), why should one expect their site to be profitable from ads alone? If my limited edition, 250-prints-per-month 'zine isn't making money, is that the advertising industry's fault, or is there an issue with my expectations? People ask the "how do we fix dwindling ad-based revenue" question all the time. The answer is clear, it's just not what people want to hear: metered…

Seems a bit disingenuous to suggest a paywall when the first thing anyone does on this website with a paywalled article is attempt to bypass. Such a bad faith move to say "use a paywall" and then promptly follow it up with "and I'll try to bypass it to access the content".

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#174

Post by dublinben » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:51 PM UTC

thinkMOAR wrote: post #122

fiatjaf wrote: post #4

Ok, you have a sponsorship model that works because you're probably very famous. That doesn't solve anyone's problem, because almost no one is famous. How can we replace ad networks with something better and saner?

Not only famous, but i assume a 'Microsoft Regional Director' makes enough money to pay for a hosted blog. Though great to see that there is a site less on the internet leaking their visitor information to ad networks and their affiliates....

Apparently that title is an honorary one, and does not actually confer any financial benefits directly from Microsoft. [0]

[0] http://www.thewindowsclub.com/microsoft-regional-director-pr...

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#175

Post by AndrewStephens » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:51 PM UTC

jff wrote: post #166

AndrewStephens wrote: post #84

I went a step further and designed my blog ( https://sheep.horse/ ) not to use any third-party resources at all. This was easy for me because I am never going to make money from my ramblings about Rogue One or the last book I read. I am actually not against advertising in principle, or even tracking if that is what you want, but the current trend to pull in lots of resources (ads, tracking scripts, web fonts, CDN jav…

I have the same philosophy. I have, over the last couple of years, stripped Javascript and other external assets from my site. First I removed Disqus from my blog, because Internet comments are a cesspit anyway. Then I removed Google Analytics because the tracking outweighs the benefits. Then I removed an externally-loaded font. I finally figured out the last thing, a little bit of JS that Cloudflare was injecting to…

I kind of miss analytics but I don't want to force my readers to run Javascript just to satisfy my curiosity. I can go through my logs if I want to see how many people read a page.

My old wordpress blog got so few legitimate comments that I never bother to add a commenting system into my new software. Even when a post got hundreds of reads due to being linked on slashdot or whatever, very few people left comments directly. Perhaps I just have nothing interesting to say.

If you add Disqus then you are just effectively letting other people make money off your content and if anyone makes money off my writing it should be me. I figure if anyone wants to tell me something about my posts they can contact me in many other ways.

Plus, even if I loved Disqus (and it is pretty sweet if you want that functionality), who knows if they are going to be operating in 5 years time? They could go under or get bought out by someone who plasters ads everywhere. Then it is bye-bye to years worth of content in the comments.

Much better, I think, to be responsible for hosting everything your users will see, even if it means forgoing some of the nice functionality third-parties can provide.The cost-benefit ratio just isn't favorable.

I considered obfuscating my email address but I couldn't remember the last time spam actually hit my gmail inbox.

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#176

Post by vintageseltzer » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:52 PM UTC

I often wonder why an open-source advertising system (like a self-hosted AdWords) hasn't caught on.

When it comes to ads on my site, I'd love to cut out the middle man and be able to manage my own clients, content, tracking and payments, all served from my own domain.

I've seen a few sites managing this on their own, and the result has been great: well-targeted, nicely-designed ads that the site owners and advertisers stand behind. It definitely takes more work, but I don't see anything wrong with that.

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#177

Post by pmlnr » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:54 PM UTC

r1ch wrote: post #12

You'll be surprised how much faster pages feel without ad scripts - I noticed significant improvements after implementing a no-ads premium option on our website. Even with an ad blocker, things just feel snappier if the scripts simply aren't there in the first place. I decided to go one step further with my personal site and eliminate all JS completely. I don't get enough traffic to make any kind of analytics or ad c…

> I decided to go one step further with my personal site and eliminate all JS completely. I don't get enough traffic to make any kind of analytics or ad code worthwhile.

I did the same a little while ago; if I want stats, I'll render them from the access logs, webalizer-style[^1].

Static HTML, with inlined CSS and SVG can get ridiculously fast on today's network, so if you don't have any actual reasons for JS (there are a lot of things CSS can do these days), just leave it behind. (You can also safely leave fonts, Google Analytics and all those external monsters behind.)

Here's my summary on the experience of moving from WordPress to static HTML for longetivity and robustness:

https://petermolnar.net/going-static

[^1]: http://www.webalizer.org/

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#178

Post by rhapsodyv » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:55 PM UTC

fiatjaf wrote: post #4

Ok, you have a sponsorship model that works because you're probably very famous. That doesn't solve anyone's problem, because almost no one is famous. How can we replace ad networks with something better and saner?

Another point: Facebook is increasily adding features so people don't need to leave to read or anything else.

How ad networks will adapt to that? In a short or mid-term future aren't just the famous and niche content blog that will survive?

Just thoughts...

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#179

Post by cr0sh » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:58 PM UTC

vintageseltzer wrote: post #168

fiatjaf wrote: post #4

Ok, you have a sponsorship model that works because you're probably very famous. That doesn't solve anyone's problem, because almost no one is famous. How can we replace ad networks with something better and saner?

May I ask: if one is not "famous" (i.e. popular), why should one expect their site to be profitable from ads alone? If my limited edition, 250-prints-per-month 'zine isn't making money, is that the advertising industry's fault, or is there an issue with my expectations? People ask the "how do we fix dwindling ad-based revenue" question all the time. The answer is clear, it's just not what people want to hear: metered…

I kinda agree with you; I run a personal website, it isn't very popular (and I don't update it often - hmm, maybe there's a link there!) - but it is my website, and I've kept the domain active since 1998 or thereabouts.

ie - a "labor of love"

How do I pay for it? Well, I reach around to my back pocket for my wallet, and...

I don't have ads, I don't have a sponsorship, and I don't care - what I have and what I put on my website is strictly for myself and others to use or read as they see fit; I consider it a "giving back" to others out there for what the internet has given me over the years.

...and I am fine with that.

Other sites need to realize this too; not everything is worth money, and if you really love what you're doing, you'd give it away free. Like the internet used to be - everybody doing it for the love of networking and computing and knowledge and information transfer.

Not AOL spam making money crap.

Re: I've removed all ad network code from my blog

#180

Post by ddebernardy » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 4:59 PM UTC

walterbell wrote: post #112

ddebernardy wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is something wrong with this model? Detecting fraudulent ad views and clicks.

Which parties perform fraud / bot detection today?

There was a dozen plus last I worked in the field. There are scores of horror stories related to ad fraud. In particular:

- PPV ads that get stacked. That, several ads laid out on top of each other so that only one (if any at all) is visible.

- PPV ads that get served to bots. Sometimes purposely so, other times as a result of phantom users who replay sessions to build fake profiles for PPC purposes.

- Ad injection that replace legit ads or include new ones via browser toolbars or compromised devices.

- PPC fraud, of course, including some combined with all of the above.

- PPA fraud through cookie stuffing, meaning flooding browsers with cookies to make it look like the traffic originate from where it doesn't.

- PPA fraud through ad injection. Nothing converts better than a popover served via ad injection for the very site you're shopping on.

I'm sure I'm forgetting quite a few, but at a high level those are the main ones to be aware of. As an advertiser you generally cannot rely on the stats you're provided with.