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Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

fittish.deadspin.com

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Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#171

Post by drewnoakes »

erpellan wrote: post #164
jdietrich wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a balance between man and machine, between tradition and progress. F1 racing cars would be faster if they replaced the driver with a computer. The fans want to see the skills of the driver tested, so the sport bans common driver aids like traction control and anti-lock brakes. Cycling with motors isn't cycling, it's motorcycling. Allowing motors would change the sport in an undesirable and irrevocable manner. In…

I'd love to see an autonomous F1 series!

There's an initiative to do just that.

http://www.roborace.com

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#172

Post by bigiain »

aaronbeekay wrote: post #166
bigiain wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interestingly, they race electric motorcycles at the Isle of Mann TT, and the riders all talk about how it's a different game to racing fuel-powered bikes - the bikes are capable of using up all their energy much more quickly that a fuel powered bike, so it becomes as much an efficiency trial as a race, they need to manage their energy consumption to ensure they make it to the finish line (all while still averaging o…

I work on a team that designed two electric motorcycles for the IOM TT Zero. Yes, it's a very different game from the gas races. Aero and energy storage on board are the primary concerns - the top team for the past several years has been successful primarily by packing on ~20-30% more energy than their competitors, so that they can go faster, for longer. The TT is really an edge case, though, since it is such a long…

If you've been there a while, I probably met you, or at least your colleagues - a few years back at Maker Faire (where you were showing off a yellow motorcycle, from memory R6 based?), and again at Sears Point for the first US TTxGp back in maybe 2010?

One of your guys (Richard?) offered to get me good prices on Agni motors and packs of A123 cells for $300-ish per kWHr. (I should have taken him up on that... My current ride is a probably-illegal-in-CA 125cc two stroke Cagiva Mito - which is a barrel of fun! I could easily see myself looking for 30 or 40kW of electric motor/controller/battery to jam inside it next time it needs a complete engine rebuild...)

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#173

Post by Ensorceled »

jacquesm wrote: post #161
nradov wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No the extra weight of a flywheel plus motor/generator would far outweigh any small advantage. The energy density is just too low for any flywheel small enough to fit on a bike. And the gyroscopic effects would mess with handling.

Bikes already have two really large flywheels.

They don't spin fast enough nor with enough mass to help you climb a hill ...

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#174

Post by hinkley »

tzs wrote: post #112
jdietrich wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Technology is an integral part of cycling, just as it is in motorsport. There are some one-design motorsport racing classes, but they are far from the most popular. Fans like to see innovation, we like to coo over the beautiful new machinery on display. Some of the greatest moments in cycling are directly related to technical progress, most obviously the Obree/Boardman battle for the hour record. On one side a profes…

How about something in between? A rider and a manufacturer can work together to design a new bike for that rider, but for actual races the manufacturer has to build an instance of that bike under supervision of race officials and turn it over to them, and it is that instance that the rider must use in the race. Once the bike is turned over to race officials, no one is allowed unsupervised access. That allows innovati…

Those bikes tend to get stripped down every day. Some of the frame designs have at times been rated for less than 10k miles, meaning they wear out at some point, possibly before the end of the race.

For instance a commercial aluminum frame is overbuilt so that it doesn't vibrate itself to pieces, but if you are going to get a new one in a week why bother?

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#175

Post by usrusr »

jacquesm wrote: post #161
nradov wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No the extra weight of a flywheel plus motor/generator would far outweigh any small advantage. The energy density is just too low for any flywheel small enough to fit on a bike. And the gyroscopic effects would mess with handling.

Bikes already have two really large flywheels.

And people spend a lot of money to make them store just a tiny little less energy.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#176

Post by ehnto »

westward wrote: post #46

If I were a competitor, who wanted an honest race, is there anything my team could do to neutralize either of these techniques?

You're making me imagine a Mario Kart style escalation of cheating and anti-cheating techniques.

Maybe an EMP equipped tortoise shell would do the trick!

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#177

Post by anjc »

PeterStuer wrote: post #155

Let's be clear. This is 100% cheating in races and can not be condoned. Otoh, I don't get the outrage by someone like Eddy Merckx, calling for a lifelong ban on Femke Van Den Driessche , the young female cyclist that was found to have a bike with an seatpost motor in her materials stand. You have to realize Merckx himself was caught several times on doping, receiving only mild punishments, and also one of those ex-ra…

I assume that most people would feel that a motor in a manual bicycle is far more of an egregious rule-break than performance enhancing drugs, which are an aspect of every pro sport in the world.

That video of her bike doing donuts on its own makes a complete mockery of the sport.

I don't know if she should be banned for life, but certainly her career needs to be affected. 3 year ban or something.

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#178

Post by anjc »

davidw wrote: post #153

I've been following this one on the cycling blogs, and I have a fairly cynical take on it: * They didn't actually name anyone. * They didn't catch anyone with a motor, red handed. * They did, however, manage to produce another 'cycling is dirty' narrative. Pretty useless, IMO.

Well except there's a video of someone's bike skidding around on its own on the site. So the motors do exist in the sport...

Re: Thermal camera footage allegedly shows pro cyclists using motors

#180

Post by [deleted] »

niels_olson wrote: post #47

Am I the only cyclist here? I can't imagine voluntarily putting batteries in my bike on a long, mountainous stage. There's no way the batteries will last, and then I'm stuck with dead weight. And, looking through the actual documentary, I didn't see any incontrovertable thermal proof of a battery in any racer. In the guy posing for a shot, yes, but not in the cyclists laboring up the hill.

[deleted]
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